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View Full Version : Scout scopes on Garands? Step in here please.


oodnoodn
03-18-2011, 04:40 PM
For those of you that put scout scopes on your Garands, tell us which scope you've got & what height (& type if you remember) rings you used. What would you do different if you were going to do it over?

Pics are not mandatory but certainly welcome.

I've seen occasional scout scope posts in various threads in the past, I'm looking for a fresh consolidated gathering of the knowledge.

Thanks!

:D

Mac O tac
03-18-2011, 05:14 PM
For those of you that put scout scopes on your Garands, tell us which scope you've got & what height (& type if you remember) rings you used. What would you do different if you were going to do it over?

Pics are not mandatory but certainly welcome.

I've seen occasional scout scope posts in various threads in the past, I'm looking for a fresh consolidated gathering of the knowledge.

Thanks!

:D

Yeah, C'mon some of you guys have to be in the know on this. Please bring oodnoodn and the rest of us up to speed. I have a couple of SGs that are capable of a lot more than I. I wanna be able to hit more than the side of the barn again.

steelap
03-18-2011, 06:27 PM
For my scout scoped Garand I use a Burris Handgun scope - 2-7x32.

However, I must say that I prefer the M1D and faux M1C/M1D rifles:

1. 3-9x40 Burris on a S&K mount

2. ? on a B-Square (not mounted yet, finally got a decent B-Square, but I haven't cut a filler block yet)

3. M84 on a USGI M1D mount (on an M1D rifle)

Having the eyepiece closer to the eye compensates for the offset scope. especially as for the faux mounts that simulate an M1C or M1D rifles I can use the windage correcting rings.

The only downside to the faux mounts versus a real M1D or M1C is that the scope mounts replace the rear sight. Having said that, the S&K mount has an integral rear iron sight.

"Life is Good!"

50cal
03-18-2011, 10:07 PM
I used a 2 power pistol scope and it cut the group size in half at 100 yards, the rings that i used were Weaver steel med high i think , you have to set your chin on the top of the butt almost to shoot it .

wareagle69
03-18-2011, 11:32 PM
Burris 3-12x32mm handgun scope. Warne Quick Detach low rings. Works very well for me.

Bromel
03-19-2011, 07:34 AM
I did a ton of research on this last fall. This is what I ended up getting for christmas:

Burris 2.75 x 20mm Scout Scope
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=606819

Leupold 1" QRW Quick Release Rings Matte
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=463702

Amega Ranges M1 Garand Scout Mount
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=24756/Product/MINI_SCOUT_MOUNT

The nice thing about the quick release rings is that you can take the scope off to use the iron sights if you want to.

Talyn
03-19-2011, 12:32 PM
Go with the UltiMak mount. It's far better than the Amega Ranges.

http://ultimak.com/M12.htm

I dropped my Amega Ranges mount for the UltiMak. I have a 2-7x Burris handgun scope with ARMS QR med rings.

Bromel
03-19-2011, 01:09 PM
Go with the UltiMak mount. It's far better than the Amega Ranges.

http://ultimak.com/M12.htm

I dropped my Amega Ranges mount for the UltiMak. I have a 2-7x Burris handgun scope with ARMS QR med rings.

What is better about the Ultimak?

Ericc
03-19-2011, 02:14 PM
For those of you that put scout scopes on your Garands, tell us which scope you've got & what height (& type if you remember) rings you used. What would you do different if you were going to do it over?

:D

Here is a project I did a year or so ago now for a family member that wanted a scoped rifle. It started out as a woodless racker with a 1.3M SA receiver. I re-parked all the parts and re-barreled the rifle and put a stock on it.

Scope is a burris 2-7x pistol scope with their low height mounts. The rifle is a tack driver.

The only issue I have with it is scope height. It needs about 1/2 of cheek pad to get a proper cheek weld on the rifle.

http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/5511/burris.jpg

Eric

Mac O tac
03-19-2011, 03:14 PM
It seems that few if any use the mount that goes in place of the rear sight. Why is that?

Talyn
03-19-2011, 06:36 PM
What is better about the Ultimak?

I switched over from a Amega Ranges mount to an Ultimak mount since it attaches far more secure than the Amega Ranges.

There are two very stout rings and small bolts used on the Ultimak vs a thin interior liner and multiple short & small screws on the Amega Ranges.

I never had any problems with the Amega Ranges. I just never liked it since I knew there could be something better. The Amega seems to be overly bulky but with the provision for side rails I can see why it's taller.

I have used UltiMak scout mounts for M1As for several years and have been really impressed with them. I used to live in the general area where UltiMak is and stopped by their office a couple times a few years ago. I told them how great their M1A mount was and suggested they make a Garand version. But they were busy with their AK mounts.

The UlitMak has a better & strong attachment system IMO, which can be checked from the top. The AmegaRanges uses multiple smaller screws underneath the barrel so one must take the stock off to check or retighten.

The UltiMak is much lower profile allowing for a better cheek weld. The rail seems to me more in spec than the Amega. The finish is a matte annodized whereas the Amega is a polished finish. The Amega has side accessory rail holes for mounting side rails at 2 & 10. If you don't use these they could allow for water to enter into the barrel area in rainy conditions.

I took my "hunting Garand to the range today & the UltiMak mount was rock solid. The mount is noticeably lower than the Amega Ranges & I got a very good cheek weld with my scope set-up. IMO the UltiMak mount is the best scout set-up for the Garand.

My .02

Here's a link to a long discussion on AR15.com on the topic. I posted my .02 there & there's also pics of the UltiMak mount.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=6&t=338000

Bromel
03-20-2011, 07:07 AM
It seems that few if any use the mount that goes in place of the rear sight. Why is that?

There are some who use the rear scope mount, but that would not be considered a "scout" scope configuration. And that is what the original poster inquired about.

Bromel
03-20-2011, 01:28 PM
I switched over from a Amega Ranges mount to an Ultimak mount since it attaches far more secure than the Amega Ranges.

There are two very stout rings and small bolts used on the Ultimak vs a thin interior liner and multiple short & small screws on the Amega Ranges.

I never had any problems with the Amega Ranges. I just never liked it since I knew there could be something better. The Amega seems to be overly bulky but with the provision for side rails I can see why it's taller.

I have used UltiMak scout mounts for M1As for several years and have been really impressed with them. I used to live in the general area where UltiMak is and stopped by their office a couple times a few years ago. I told them how great their M1A mount was and suggested they make a Garand version. But they were busy with their AK mounts.

The UlitMak has a better & strong attachment system IMO, which can be checked from the top. The AmegaRanges uses multiple smaller screws underneath the barrel so one must take the stock off to check or retighten.

The UltiMak is much lower profile allowing for a better cheek weld. The rail seems to me more in spec than the Amega. The finish is a matte annodized whereas the Amega is a polished finish. The Amega has side accessory rail holes for mounting side rails at 2 & 10. If you don't use these they could allow for water to enter into the barrel area in rainy conditions.

I took my "hunting Garand to the range today & the UltiMak mount was rock solid. The mount is noticeably lower than the Amega Ranges & I got a very good cheek weld with my scope set-up. IMO the UltiMak mount is the best scout set-up for the Garand.

My .02

Here's a link to a long discussion on AR15.com on the topic. I posted my .02 there & there's also pics of the UltiMak mount.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=6&t=338000

Talyn:

Thanks for the info. I noticed that the Ultimak is lower than the Amega Ranges. Do the iron sights get in the way of your sight picture? Which rings do you use?

oodnoodn
03-20-2011, 01:42 PM
OK, I'm seeing several Burris pistol scope users. I'm leaning toward the Burris 2x7 pistol scope with the b plex reticle, & quick detach rings like the Leupold or Warne. The Ultimak mount is already incoming.

Talyn: will low rings work OK with the Ultimak?

Talyn
03-20-2011, 03:26 PM
OK, I'm seeing several Burris pistol scope users. I'm leaning toward the Burris 2x7 pistol scope with the b plex reticle, & quick detach rings like the Leupold or Warne. The Ultimak mount is already incoming.

Talyn: will low rings work OK with the Ultimak?

The UltiMak mount is so low I don't see how anything lower than medium rings would work. Perhaps a scope with an objective the same diameter as the tube would go lower but the eye piece diameter would decide that since the UltiMak is a hair lower than the front of the receiver. Having used Burris scopes in this & on M1As I don't see anything other than mediums working but different manufacturers have different interpretations of various ring heights even though they all name them low, med, high. etc.

Talyn
03-20-2011, 03:28 PM
Talyn:

Thanks for the info. I noticed that the Ultimak is lower than the Amega Ranges. Do the iron sights get in the way of your sight picture? Which rings do you use?

Replied to your PM, but no the irons dont interfer since the scope level is still higher. I use ARMS #22 med quick release rings.

oodnoodn
04-01-2011, 04:08 PM
Alrighty, here's my setup.
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn72/oodn-oodn/HRASG15.jpg
Ultimak mount, Leupold medium QR rings (on sale at Midway right now), & Burris 2x7 pistol scope with b plex reticle. I can remove & reattach the scope without zero changing (woohoo!), scope sits just a little higher than the iron sights so I don't need a cheek pad, & eye relief with the pistol scope is fine.

Here are range results from today. Small target is 100 yds, large target from 200 yds. I can match that group with iron sights at 100 yds, but the scope sure helps at 200. I like to think that the groups will tighten up a bit as the gun settles into the new stock, & the trigger is a bit stiff so I'll probably attack it with a stone in the near future.
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn72/oodn-oodn/HRASG18.jpg
Adding a decent scope ain't cheap; scope/mount/rings cost as much as another SG.

Edit: & thanks all you guys that have been down this road & provided info/encouragement. If I didn't have y'alls lessons learned I'd still be sitting here undecided. Thanks!

OKC_Jim
04-01-2011, 08:32 PM
oodnoodn, nice looking scope set-up. I have occasionally thought abut doing something like that. If you were to do it again, is there anything at all you'd do differently?

Talyn
04-01-2011, 08:41 PM
Alrighty, here's my setup.
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn72/oodn-oodn/HRASG15.jpg
Ultimak mount, Leupold medium QR rings (on sale at Midway right now), & Burris 2x7 pistol scope with b plex reticle. I can remove & reattach the scope without zero changing (woohoo!), scope sits just a little higher than the iron sights so I don't need a cheek pad, & eye relief with the pistol scope is fine.

Here are range results from today. Small target is 100 yds, large target from 200 yds. I can match that group with iron sights at 100 yds, but the scope sure helps at 200. I like to think that the groups will tighten up a bit as the gun settles into the new stock, & the trigger is a bit stiff so I'll probably attack it with a stone in the near future.
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn72/oodn-oodn/HRASG18.jpg
Adding a decent scope ain't cheap; scope/mount/rings cost as much as another SG.

Edit: & thanks all you guys that have been down this road & provided info/encouragement. If I didn't have y'alls lessons learned I'd still be sitting here undecided. Thanks!

No problemo. Nice set-up. Best scout mount around IMO.

oodnoodn
04-01-2011, 08:54 PM
oodnoodn, nice looking scope set-up. I have occasionally thought abut doing something like that. If you were to do it again, is there anything at all you'd do differently?

At this time no. I'd consider getting a cheaper scope & adjust for distance with the elevation knob, but once I get past this broke spell recovering from the scope purchase I'll be glad I got a good scope.

M1ashot
04-01-2011, 10:59 PM
Nikon 2.5-8x BDC EER with A.R.M.S low QR rings. I use A.R.M.S on most of my scoped military rifles. Nikon focuses when changing power and eye relief is excellent on scout mount

11th ACR
04-04-2011, 06:45 PM
My setup is a little different. I used the CMP mount with an Aim Point red dot scope.

eejit
04-13-2011, 12:11 PM
Does anyone have a problem with the ultimak on a Garand not stayig tight? I was going to purchase this mount for my Garand but I would think the heating and cooling of the barrel woud affect the mount staying tight or shifting point of impact. Anyone run into this problem?

oodnoodn
04-13-2011, 12:42 PM
Does anyone have a problem with the ultimak on a Garand not stayig tight? I was going to purchase this mount for my Garand but I would think the heating and cooling of the barrel woud affect the mount staying tight or shifting point of impact. Anyone run into this problem?

Not yet, but mine's the new kid on the block & it hasn't been through many heat/cool cycles yet.

dprice3844444
04-13-2011, 07:34 PM
hi-lux.com aka leatherwood maks a nice 2x7x32 scope long eye relief that the used in the shotgun news article on the ruger scout rifle that got good reviews.natchez shooters supply should have them.

http://www.amegaranges.com/product_pages/m1garand.html makes a garand mount

bruce
04-13-2011, 10:15 PM
Hum... I've got a "spare" M-1 in the cabinet. And a fellow gun club member gave me a nice Nikon 2x EER scope that came on a pistol he bought. He didn't want the scope. Charged me $5.00 for it. Looks like all that needed is a Ultimak mount, some rings and I'm in business for next deer season! Wonderful thread!

eejit
04-14-2011, 07:29 AM
I've heard nothing but good about the ultimak mounting system, I'm going to give it a try.

Strait
04-30-2011, 09:07 PM
I was disappointed to miss out on the CMP scout mounts but now seeing the UltiMAK I am glad I didn't buy the CMP mount. I will need to find a scope, but I have to wait for a sale or a bargain. Thanks for the heads up on this, Talyn!

dprice3844444
04-30-2011, 09:09 PM
try natchez shooters supply for the 2x7x32 leatherwood scope hi-luxoptics.com

wgandy
04-30-2011, 10:23 PM
Here's my latest project:
Super Scout Base
Leupold Quick Release Rings
BSA 2-7x Scope

Took it out to the range today and had a blast with it.

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee78/wgandy/Scout%20Scope%20Project/DSC_0005_1405.jpg

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee78/wgandy/Scout%20Scope%20Project/DSC_0007_1407-a-1.jpg

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee78/wgandy/Scout%20Scope%20Project/DSC_0008_1408-1.jpg

.22shooter
05-01-2011, 11:03 AM
These guys are located in PA and make non permanent mounts

http://www.scopemounts.com/index.html?main.html

bch7773
05-03-2011, 05:37 PM
the m1 garand already is pretty heavy, how much does the scope and mount add to weight?

seems like a great range toy but I wouldn't wanna carry them all over while hunting

oodnoodn
05-03-2011, 05:53 PM
Good question. Holding rifles while standing on the bathroom scale, my scoped Garand makes me almost 2lb heavier than when holding a regular Garand. My scoped Garand has the laminated stock which may be a tad heavier than USGI walnut.

Above check is not too scientific as my bathroom scale isn't terribly accurate. I do know the Ultimak mount only weighs a couple ounces more than the piece of wood it replaces, & scopes are pretty light nowadays. My Leupold rings (steel) were surprisingly heavy.

M1ashot
05-04-2011, 10:51 PM
I believe unimax made CMP mount I have both. No problem

Strait
05-06-2011, 05:27 PM
the m1 garand already is pretty heavy, how much does the scope and mount add to weight?

seems like a great range toy but I wouldn't wanna carry them all over while hunting

I just installed the UltiMAK - I am happy with it, although I first thought it was about $50 too much, but my final opinion is that I purchased a quality product - so worth the money.

I am planning to install a Zeiss Z point reflex sight, as this seems to have a low center of bore and light weight.

One disappointment with this modification - the Ultimak is about 4 ounces heavier than the original wood. Not certain what the the sight will add yet.

So...expect a quarter of pound increased weight, at least. I am starting to think about a lighter synthetic stock to compensate.

Also, count the cost - I debated about purchasing another FG Garand vs. modifying my current Garand. I decided on modifying my current Garand - so after a scope rail/rear handguard and the optics to perch upon it - well, I just moved purchasing another field grade or service grade Garand back another year or more.

But I am pleased with what is developing, so far.

Kirk in AL
05-14-2011, 07:47 PM
The Amegaranges/CMP mount puts the scope right over the bore (not off to one side) and the brass does not hit the scope or mount when it is ejected.

MH53Gunner
05-14-2011, 08:09 PM
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj249/mh53gunner/firearms209.jpg

http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj249/mh53gunner/firearms203_edited-1.jpg

NC Star low budget scope.
CMP mount
Can't remember the maker of the rings.

plarkinjr
05-20-2011, 01:41 PM
I have an ultimak, and topped it with a 2x TruGlo red-dot site I had laying around (quite affordable). Works great! Mount as low as possible. One of these days I'll try something like a is pictured above.

DJEinConcord
05-20-2011, 04:17 PM
OK, I'm seeing several Burris pistol scope users. I'm leaning toward the Burris 2x7 pistol scope with the b plex reticle, & quick detach rings like the Leupold or Warne. The Ultimak mount is already incoming.

Talyn: will low rings work OK with the Ultimak?

That is the scope I put on my .308 tanker with Warne quick detach rings-the 2x7 with posi-lock. Skip the posi lock. I never set mine and the zero never changes. Why spend the money if yo don't need it.

I liked that B-Plex scope so much I bought one for my 300 WSM in 3X9, and one for my Rem 700 .308 in 4.5-14x42.

From here on I will probably only buy Burris Ballestic Plex scopes. I like them that mucm. Tomorrow at 9 am I intend to put the 300WSM on some 300, 400 and 500 yard targets in the Nevada desert with a new 165 sst load.

TRICKSTER
11-20-2011, 07:04 PM
My latest project. Built from a CMP woodless Winchester. For you purest out there, no permanent modification was done. Remains to be seen if the bipod will effect accuracy. Hopefully I can take it out and get it sighted in next week.

Ultimak M1 Garand mount.
Burris Scout 2.75x 20mm Heavy Plex Reticle Matte Black Riflescope
Leupold Quick Release Weaver Style Rings
http://i487.photobucket.com/albums/rr233/RLH178/100_0351.jpg

EasyCompany
11-21-2011, 02:57 AM
It seems that few if any use the mount that goes in place of the rear sight. Why is that?

Dunno, mine works fine - got a Leupold 3-9x/50mm on it and with a Blackhawk Cheekpad, it is perfect.

RVN 69-70
11-21-2011, 08:12 AM
Good job....show us how she groups.



My latest project. Built from a CMP woodless Winchester. For you purest out there, no permanent modification was done. Remains to be seen if the bipod will effect accuracy. Hopefully I can take it out and get it sighted in next week.

Ultimak M1 Garand mount.
Burris Scout 2.75x 20mm Heavy Plex Reticle Matte Black Riflescope
Leupold Quick Release Weaver Style Rings
http://i487.photobucket.com/albums/rr233/RLH178/100_0351.jpg

Oscar
11-21-2011, 06:18 PM
The FrankenGarand.. figured I'd go whole hog and put a muzzle break as well:

A Burris pistol scope 3-12.


http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j102/snoolr/Frankengarand2.jpg

BrocLuno
11-23-2011, 08:32 PM
Here is a project I did a year or so ago now for a family member that wanted a scoped rifle. It started out as a woodless racker with a 1.3M SA receiver. I re-parked all the parts and re-barreled the rifle and put a stock on it.

Scope is a burris 2-7x pistol scope with their low height mounts. The rifle is a tack driver.

The only issue I have with it is scope height. It needs about 1/2 of cheek pad to get a proper cheek weld on the rifle.

http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/5511/burris.jpg

I'm looking at Burris FastFire II mini red dot mounted directly to the flat on the UltiMAK through the two countersunk screw holes in the base of the FastFire. Have not finished working out the numbers yet, but I think it will co-witness with the irons (red dot will float above). Should be interesting :)

Eric

I think that with the UltiMAK you would be a lot closer to the wood, maybe need a Cheekeze pad at most?

buckshot85
01-29-2012, 12:12 PM
any of you guys have trouble with the brass hitting the scope?

dprice3844444
01-29-2012, 12:47 PM
if the scope is mounted where the top handguard is,why would it hit?

buckshot85
01-29-2012, 01:06 PM
ahh, well, i'm not sure, but i think the scope sits a little higher than the handguard. and i have had the oprod kick the brass forward occasionnaly and i think that my rifle isn't the only one that does that.

50cal
01-29-2012, 03:06 PM
Never had any brass hit the scope, but like i said it is high so a cheek weld on the stock is just not going to happen but it shoots great any way.

buckshot85
01-29-2012, 04:58 PM
i had read that some mounts may need clearancing at the oprod notch. has anyone had to remove a little metal above the oprod?

steve0
08-22-2013, 12:41 PM
Hello everyone. I ordered 4 M1 HRA SG and plan on mounting a scope(probably scout) to one of them, so I brought this old thread back up rather than create a new one. Anyone try the new Leupold variables? I think the eye relief is probably too short.

milgunsguy
08-22-2013, 03:54 PM
The "M-8" model, 2 power, tapered crosshairs. The best.

USMA84DAB
08-22-2013, 05:19 PM
I have the Leupold scout scope (2.5x) and Warne QD rings on the Ultimak rail. Have not gotten to shoot it a great deal yet, but pleased so far.

bigchuck350
08-22-2013, 07:19 PM
I have 3 scout scope sets currently. Using a Leupold 2.5X, Weaver 4X, and Leatherwood 2-7X variable set on 4X. With my bad eyes the cheap Leatherwood easily gives the best and clearest images. I agree the eye relief on the new Leupold variables is too short. Burris is now listing a 2-7X variable scout scope. Thinking about trying one myself. Also prefer the Ultimak mount over the competition.

hamourkiller
08-23-2013, 12:00 AM
Here is my Garand with the Burris 2x7 and the Ultimak

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a178/HamourKiller/Hunting/2011%20Deer%20Season/DSC07061.jpg (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/HamourKiller/media/Hunting/2011%20Deer%20Season/DSC07061.jpg.html)
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a178/HamourKiller/Hunting/2011%20Deer%20Season/DSC07060-1.jpg (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/HamourKiller/media/Hunting/2011%20Deer%20Season/DSC07060-1.jpg.html)

douglas34474
08-23-2013, 02:34 AM
I have the Ultimak rail with Weaver low rings and a Leupold 2.5X28 IER scope. Also have a T-37 break on it, a unitized forward hand guard and a Triple K leather 3/4" comb riser. Still working up a load for this rifle, an all Springfield 5/55 that looks almost unfired.

Fogtripper
08-23-2013, 09:49 AM
The "M-8" model, 2 power, tapered crosshairs. The best.

As a scout scope?

BrocLuno
08-24-2013, 11:06 AM
My setup is a little different. I used the CMP mount with an Aim Point red dot scope.

Got any pictures of your setup?