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trapperjohn17404
04-05-2011, 12:11 PM
I have searched the GCA journal index but to no avail on a M1 Garand 22 caliber training rifle. Does anyone have any sources on this subject? Thanks

EarlB
04-05-2011, 12:26 PM
About the closest you will find (it was not adopted, so technically wan't a US trainer) is the Springfield 87m. It is NOT usually a cheap .22 :)

As for US government M1 trainers - look for the H&R Model 65 or Marine version the MC 58. Also not cheap. They won't look quite as much like an M1 though as the 87m.

Earl

67Lemanster
04-05-2011, 03:51 PM
there was an article in this months publication about converting(lots of work) a 10/22 to look and act like a garand.

Ltcboy
04-05-2011, 04:37 PM
there was an article in this months publication about converting(lots of work) a 10/22 to look and act like a garand.


I read that article, just doesnt seem practical.

farmritch
04-05-2011, 05:13 PM
I was at the Kansas city cun show last summer there was a guy there with a Marlin and the best display for it.
Looked and felt much like a Garand.
Thier gun shows out there are actually shows with displays and information it was cool.
I can not remember the Model but it used many of the parts from the 89C
It was proposed and prototypes were made but a 22 Garand trainer was never adopted to my knowledge.
I think he told me there are 10 or 15 out in the world.

Rick B
04-05-2011, 05:16 PM
I seen one that looked almost like a Garand so I know they exist and I was amazed. This was a month ago on a for sale page. I am going to look to see if I copied pic's but I cannot remember. Rick B

farmritch
04-05-2011, 05:16 PM
I read that article, just doesnt seem practical.


Guys do it all the time for appleseed
More resembles a M1A
But close enough for both

Rick B
04-05-2011, 05:19 PM
Here they are and they resemble the first Garand

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xm-UzSz5UmY

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?52869-WTS-Springfield-87M-(trainer-)-M1-Garand-looking-22-rifle

TomM1cGarand
04-05-2011, 07:15 PM
Check this out

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=222607094

camljr59
04-06-2011, 01:03 AM
Looks like our own Steelap bought it!!!

OK Steely... what gives???

EarlB
04-06-2011, 01:13 AM
That one has been around awhile on GB and is pretty neat. Roland makes some pretty amazing stuff. And considering he got it for what alot of people are paying these days for the 87m's - not really a bad deal.

Earl

ODCMP
04-06-2011, 08:33 AM
I don't get the excitement with the 87m's. They're just a commercial rifle with no military use.

The H&R Mod 65's and MC-58's were the true M1 and M14 semi-auto trainer, at least for the USMC.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/consecutiveMC-58srightfull.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/consecutiveMC-58sleftfull.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/consecutiveMC-58sleftreceiver.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/consecutiveMC-58srightreceiver.jpg

Dave

ODCMP
04-06-2011, 08:35 AM
A few more pics.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/consecutiveMC-58stopreceiver.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/consecutiveMC-58sbottomangle.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/MC-58USMCPropertyMarkedReceiver.jpg
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/MC-58USMCPropertyMarkedBarrel.jpg

Dave

Rick B
04-06-2011, 06:28 PM
Those were more like Reising wwii gun copies. Rick B

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/41/Reisingm50.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/39/Reisingm50r.jpg

And even called the trainer for them here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M50_Reising

ODCMP
04-06-2011, 11:11 PM
I guess you could call them copies of the Reising SMG's, since they were both designed by Eugene Reising, but that wasn't their purpose.

The reason the Marine Corp procured the H&R Mod 65's was as a trainer for the M1 rifle. They didn't consider the bolt action trainers acceptable. Their inital order of the Mod 65's coincided with the Marines first use of the M1's, and their later order of the MC-58's directly coincided with the introduction of the M14 in 1959.

Their weight, balance and sight picture are an almost exact match for the M1 and M14 rifles.

Dave

EarlB
04-06-2011, 11:18 PM
Has the CMP ever sold the Riesings? Just curious. Earl

ODCMP
04-07-2011, 08:34 AM
Has the CMP ever sold the Riesings? Just curious. Earl

Yes, they auctioned about 75 of the MC-58's from around 2001-2003. They were new in the unopened box from H&R with the manuals, sling and 2 mags. They sold from $815 up to $2760.

Dave

steelap
04-07-2011, 11:53 AM
Yes, they auctioned about 75 of the MC-58's from around 2001-2003. They were new in the unopened box from H&R with the manuals, sling and 2 mags. They sold from $815 up to $2760.

Dave

Wow!

Would have been nice. I think that now they'd go even higher.

"Life is Good!"

larrymod
04-07-2011, 12:45 PM
there was an article in this months publication about converting(lots of work) a 10/22 to look and act like a garand.

OK, I can seem making a 10/22 look sorta like a garand, but ACT like a Garand? Really? Like pushing a little bitty en bloc clip of 22lr cartridges down through the top?

I haven't read the article, but this idea just seems too ludicrous for words.

steelap
04-07-2011, 03:17 PM
there was an article in this months publication about converting(lots of work) a 10/22 to look and act like a garand.

Which publication - GCA Journal?

Thanks!

"Life is Good!"

LostSoul
04-07-2011, 03:58 PM
Like pushing a little bitty en bloc clip of 22lr cartridges down through the top?

LOL! That would be awesome... Cases of "M1 Pinkie" would abound...

Ed49
04-07-2011, 04:23 PM
ODCMP, thanks for the info and pics. I've seen the MODEL MC-58 but did not know that there is a version marked USMC PROPERTY without the MODEL MC-58 marking.

Which is the correct magazine for each rifle - the one marked MFD. BY H & R ARMS CO. or the one marked MFD. BY H & R, INC. ?

Rick B
04-07-2011, 05:09 PM
LOL! That would be awesome... Cases of "M1 Pinkie" would abound...

HEY,, don't laugh I pointed with my pinky at the seventh round mod in a rifle and it bit me as the bolt was not locked back all the way. I touched the bullet guide and WHAM. It actually broke it. Rick B

hawkins.s
04-07-2011, 10:48 PM
Here's one that I built a few years ago. I weighted the stock to feel more like a Garand. It shot as well as any 10/22.
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn252/hawkeye-025/1022GARANDBUILD001.jpg

ODCMP
04-07-2011, 11:08 PM
ODCMP, thanks for the info and pics. I've seen the MODEL MC-58 but did not know that there is a version marked USMC PROPERTY without the MODEL MC-58 marking.

Which is the correct magazine for each rifle - the one marked MFD. BY H & R ARMS CO. or the one marked MFD. BY H & R, INC. ?

The correct magazines for both the Mod 65 and the MC-58 are the ones marked H & R ARMS CO.

The markings without the MC-58 are actually the barrel markings.

There were two different types of receiver markings on the H&R MC-58 receivers. Both types are different from the earlier WWII era H&R Model 65 Reising trainers.

The two types of MC-58's are:

USMC PROPERTY, MODEL MC-58
H&R MODEL #65 MODIFIED
HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON, INC.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/MC-58USMCPropertyMarkedReceiver.jpg

and:

U.S. MODEL MC-58
H&R MODEL #65 MODIFIED
HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON, INC.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/MC-58USMarkedReceiver.jpg


The earlier WWII trainers were marked:

MOD. 65 - H.& R. REISING 22 CAL.
HARRINGTON AND RICHARDSON ARMS CO.
WORCESTER, MASS. U.S.A.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/Mod65ReceiverMarkings1.jpg

The USMC marked MC-58 rifles I have recorded seem to run in the earlier serial number range and the US in the later numbers.

Dave

Ed49
04-08-2011, 11:47 AM
Did the earlier WWII trainers marked

MOD. 65 - H.& R. REISING 22 CAL.
HARRINGTON AND RICHARDSON ARMS CO.
WORCESTER, MASS. U.S.A.

also have the M1 Garand style safety?

GarandGrabber
04-08-2011, 11:59 AM
The correct magazines for both the Mod 65 and the MC-58 are the ones marked H & R ARMS CO.

The markings without the MC-58 are actually the barrel markings.

There were two different types of receiver markings on the H&R MC-58 receivers. Both types are different from the earlier WWII era H&R Model 65 Reising trainers.

The two types of MC-58's are:

USMC PROPERTY, MODEL MC-58
H&R MODEL #65 MODIFIED
HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON, INC.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/MC-58USMCPropertyMarkedReceiver.jpg

and:

U.S. MODEL MC-58
H&R MODEL #65 MODIFIED
HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON, INC.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20MC%2058/MC-58USMarkedReceiver.jpg


The earlier WWII trainers were marked:

MOD. 65 - H.& R. REISING 22 CAL.
HARRINGTON AND RICHARDSON ARMS CO.
WORCESTER, MASS. U.S.A.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/Mod65ReceiverMarkings1.jpg

The USMC marked MC-58 rifles I have recorded seem to run in the earlier serial number range and the US in the later numbers.

Dave





I own a #65 and truly great indoor OH practice in the winter for the Garand. One of my favorite .22's

GarandGrabber
04-08-2011, 12:54 PM
That one built by Mr. Beaver is a work of art. He traveled to shows with it for sometime. I looked long and hard at that one

ODCMP
04-08-2011, 02:22 PM
Did the earlier WWII trainers marked

MOD. 65 - H.& R. REISING 22 CAL.
HARRINGTON AND RICHARDSON ARMS CO.
WORCESTER, MASS. U.S.A.

also have the M1 Garand style safety?

No, the safety on those was located on the right side of the receiver as show in this picture.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg277/mjcdmc/H%20and%20R%20Mod%2065/IMG_7971e.jpg

The bolt hold open in the picture is the later type as used in the commercial Mod 65's and the military MC-58's.

Dave

67Lemanster
04-08-2011, 02:44 PM
Which publication - GCA Journal?

Thanks!

"Life is Good!"
the one that just came out last month...i guess first 1/4

yumbeef
04-08-2011, 03:11 PM
it'd be pretty awesome if someone could make a barrel insert, conversion bolt, and 22lr enblocs for a garand :)