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View Full Version : M1 Carbine experimental Hip Holster from WWII-real or not


Deerjager
05-08-2012, 12:11 PM
Long winded, so please bear with me. I bought this a few weeks ago from a small gun shop here in Western NC. I recognized this holster from the Craig Riesch book. The store owner had received this holster with a Winchester M1 carbine he bought. The WRA M1 was an early high wood M1. The gun also came with a leather handled bayonet, canvas scabbard, belt and a cartridge pouch on the belt. There was also a set of lace up boot "gaiters" (correct nomenclature?) in a khaki canvas.

I could not buy the belt or bayonet, but he indacted the holster & gaiters (?) were for sale. He thought the holster was a paratrooper case, but he had never seen one like it. I bought it and brought it home. I took 3 different loose thread ends and burned them. The thread burned and charred and had a, for lack of a better term, "wooden" smell.

Now, I have to include this, I spent 21 years in the injection molding industry as an Engineer and two years as a body armor design Engineer and I am very familar with all the nylons (thread and resins) and know how they melt and what they smell like. Degraded nylonn 66 is a smell you never forget :D. I can identify different polymers by the smell of the burning/melting material.

I know there are reproductions out there of this item. The gun store owner did not make a declaration one way or another whether it was USGI or not. The "US" stamp is still there, but very faint as shown in last picture. I have very little experience with determining real or fakes in regards to these items and thought I would turn to the experts here. I want to resell at a later date, but do not want to promote a fake.

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae11/Deerjager/Guns/IMG_0092.jpg
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae11/Deerjager/Guns/IMG_0093.jpg
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae11/Deerjager/Guns/IMG_0094.jpg
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae11/Deerjager/Guns/IMG_0096.jpg
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae11/Deerjager/Guns/IMG_0097.jpg
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae11/Deerjager/Guns/IMG_0095.jpg

A-7-2
05-08-2012, 05:59 PM
Looks like the first model scabbard for the M1A1 carbine, normally the paratrooper wore the scabbard on the right hip, thru his pistol belt. A strap on the front of the scabbard, attached around his leg. I have the second model, with a flap on top, I bought 35 years ago. Long before the fake market appeared.

DJEinConcord
05-08-2012, 06:33 PM
It looks good. Nice Score.

One thing the sholder patch collectors do is illuminate it with a black light. Many of the modern threads glow, and period correct ones do not. But I am no expert.

Deerjager
05-08-2012, 07:59 PM
Thanks for the expert opinions. I wish I had a black light to try that. I want to go back and try again to get that belt and cartirdge pouch. I will probably only end up with the boot gaiters.

Rob W.
05-08-2012, 10:47 PM
Your carbine holster is the real thing. I've got one or two of them myself. Riesch calls them an experimental hip holster and I've also heard them called a "linesman's" holster. They are designed for the full length M1 carbine not the folding stock M1A1 which fits in the paratrooper or parachutist's canvas holster.

Bill Ricca
05-09-2012, 04:18 PM
The carbine was designed originally to replace the .45 pistol. Thus they made a long holster. It did not work out well and most were never used. Years ago you could find only Brand New. Today they are a lot harder to find.

This one looks legit.

Tester19
05-09-2012, 07:37 PM
"There was also a set of lace up boot "gaiters" (correct nomenclature?) in a khaki canvas."

Believe the common term is "leggings".

Deerjager
05-09-2012, 09:10 PM
Thank you Tester. Are these leggings common? These I found seem to be in good shape.

Tester19
05-10-2012, 06:37 PM
re Leggings: I think they are fairly common---pretty much a standard uniform item in WWII (and maybe later) I believe. I bought a couple of pair from Sportsmans Guide several years ago---one pair looked unissued and the other was in very good shape---for a pretty low price. I actually wear the things occasionally when picking blackberries on the farm, etc., to keep undesirable critters out of my pants legs. They are neat items, and I'd recommend getting them if the price is right.

Trivia: In the movie "Patton", The General (George C. Scott) threatens to fine the troops in his new command for not wearing them!

Deerjager
05-10-2012, 08:36 PM
Thanks Tester19.

T38Carbine
05-10-2012, 09:47 PM
Trivia answer...helmets and ties!!

Tester19
05-10-2012, 10:36 PM
Trivia answer...helmets and ties!!

Yep, believe you're right---believe he did ask where the leggings were, though.

Jeremy2171
05-21-2012, 02:42 PM
So what is the ballpark value on this and the M1A1 style holster? I'm going to look at one next week and it's khaki but not sure what variation it is but am about 99% positive it's real. Just dont' want to get burned..