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-   -   Which is better? (http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=132685)

swanderek 03-15-2014 10:07 AM

Which is better?
 
Got 2 service grade H&R rifles. They look pretty worn compared to some pics anyway. One is te 3+ and me 1.... The other is te3 and me2... My question is with all things being equal, which one has more life in the barrel?

DDRode 03-15-2014 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swanderek (Post 1042590)
Got 2 service grade H&R rifles. They look pretty worn compared to some pics anyway. One is te 3+ and me 1.... The other is te3 and me2... My question is with all things being equal, which one has more life in the barrel?

You'll never wear either barrel out...unless you're going to shoot at least 5,000 rounds minimum thru each of 'em!!! And...even then...they both might be good for another 3,000 - 5,000 rounds!!!

:):D;)

swanderek 03-15-2014 10:31 AM

I want to give the best to my dad.

jaw1947 03-15-2014 10:49 AM

Is letting him choose an option?

Layer Cake 03-15-2014 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaw1947 (Post 1042619)
Is letting him choose an option?

+1. Let him pick one. They sound similar. Perhaps there's one he'd be partial to.

A good gesture.

swanderek 03-15-2014 11:02 AM

What is the difference between 3 and 3+ te?

TSimonetti 03-15-2014 11:23 AM

For shooting I'd rather have a 3+/1 than a 3/2 but probably doesn't make much of a diff at 100 or 200yds. More important is stock lockup, and overall fit.

DDRode 03-15-2014 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swanderek (Post 1042611)
I want to give the best to my dad.

Let your Dad decide which one he likes...both barrels have minimal wear (they're both near new)...virtually no discernable difference (as it pertains to barrel life) between the two!!!

Take 'em both out...shoot 'em...and give your Dad his choice!!!

:):D;)

Garandimal 03-15-2014 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swanderek (Post 1042630)
What is the difference between 3 and 3+ te?

The difference is... they're not over "5".

At ~ 2,000 rounds/gauge number of wear (0.001")?

That's ~ 6,000 rounds 'till you get to the "6" mark, where it Might start to affect accuracy. But that probably won't happen until "8" or more, at ~ the 10,000 round mark of your shootin' history w/ those rifles.


Call it "near new", and enjoy them.




GR

Gewehr43 03-15-2014 12:13 PM

OP:
The issue here is that the measurements are really just a guide. The don't guarantee accuracy or something. Both measurements of "3" and "3+" could indicate new or barely used barrels. As others have pointed out both are well below US ARMY rejection standards.

Scot Duff has this in his website, maybe this will help:

This is also a good time to note that based upon my observations the TE of a new production SA barrel during World War II ran anywhere from approximately 1.0 to 3.5. Pre World War II SA barrels were usually in the 0.0 to 1.0 range. Winchester barrels were generally in the -1.0 to 2.0 range, ........

wstanley 03-15-2014 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swanderek (Post 1042590)
Got 2 service grade H&R rifles. They look pretty worn compared to some pics anyway. One is te 3+ and me 1.... The other is te3 and me2... My question is with all things being equal, which one has more life in the barrel?

I have a SA 3.364 with a 2.0 MW & TE 3.0 and other rifles with better numbers and even a recently installed NOS SA barrel and they don't shoot as good as the SA 3.364. So, shoot both to see which is the most accurate. Like others have said, if you are not shooting more than 200 yards, then either rifle should be fine.

Garandimal 03-15-2014 04:35 PM

Both will shoot inside of 4 MOA (unless there is a problem w/ the rifle), and more than likely closed to 3 MOA, w/ HXP ball ammo... out to 500 yards.

Expect b/t 2-3 MOA of even less w/ quality ammo.


Shoot them... lots.




GR

shawn 03-15-2014 06:25 PM

I my recent experience I have noticed that the CMP readings seem to be about 1/2 high. I've had a very experienced Garand collector look at and gauge a few of my rifles and they always come up a little under what the tag says.
If anyone reading goes to any of the northeast or central Wi gun shows I'm describing the older fellow that shows a rack of all makes and usually only is selling USGI Garand small parts.

CRD 04-24-2014 03:23 PM

I'm new to this gun and the forum so excuse me in my ignorance. Are lower numbers better than higher numbers or the other way around. Mine is 1+/2+.

rapid86 04-24-2014 03:59 PM

Lower are better; yours aren't bad at all, good actually. I've read that a lot of new barrels are 1 at the muzzle.

lapriester 04-24-2014 03:59 PM

They both have more life in the barrel than you'll ever use up. The ME1 barrel "may" be more accurate but even that is questionable. You'll never know until you shoot both of them and compare. 5000 rounds, LOL. I doubt, with typical recreational type or match type shooting you'll wear those barrels out in 10,000 rounds. My match barrel started out with a MW of 1.5. I have about 5000 rounds down the tube and it still reads <MW 2. It's a total myth that a barrel loses a number for ever 1000 rounds shot through it so disregard that urban myth outright. Just ain't so.

Many NIW SA barrels begin their life close to, or at, an ME 2 - ME 2.5 reading. Notice I haven't even mentioned the TE. Reason? If you are starting at a 3 or 3+ it's a reading that is completely meaningless and close to new condition. What you have are a couple of rifles that have not seen a great deal of hard or, in fact any combat use.

To answer the other poster's question, the higher the reading the more wear on that barrel area, MW being the muzzle wear, TE being throat erosion from the hot gases expelled by the cartridge and contact with the bullet. But, unless you are going to be in extended firefights where the barrel gets so hot the handguards begin to smoke and the barrel begins to erode you have nothing to worry about from either barrel for a lifetime of accurate shooting. 3+? that means when the gauge was inserted it read barely over the "3" line on the gauge.

I've actually found that CMP gauges (MW) tend to be more forgiving rather than read higher. That has been true in every case comparing it to a StoneAxe and a Folsom Armory gauge.

rgdguns 04-24-2014 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shawn (Post 1042884)
I my recent experience I have noticed that the CMP readings seem to be about 1/2 high. I've had a very experienced Garand collector look at and gauge a few of my rifles and they always come up a little under what the tag says.
If anyone reading goes to any of the northeast or central Wi gun shows I'm describing the older fellow that shows a rack of all makes and usually only is selling USGI Garand small parts.

That is about what i always get but then again how many time have the cmp gauges been used and how careful are they with them . Just imagine gauging barrels all day.

jthurman 04-25-2014 02:09 PM

I wouldn't get too worried about those numbers. Let Dad pick one and enjoy. Larry explains it well, I haven't shot enough rounds in mine to even worry. Most won't.


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