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ADDITIONAL RULES, TO INCLUDE MARKETPLACE/CLASSIFIED AD RULES:
1. Profile Requirements
To start a sale, buy or trade thread anywhere in the Marketplace, your Profile must contain:
A. Your FIRST and LAST name as well as your STATE of residence. Your profile privacy settings must be set to at least allow registered users the ability to view your profile info, i.e. - Not set to "Friends only."
B. You must "enable receive email and PM’s" in your Control panel if you intend to buy or sell.
Additionally, you must have a valid email address listed in your registration profile (which can only be viewed by moderators/admin in the vBulletin master page).
Users with obvious fake names, or using false names in their profile will be permanently removed from the forum without warning. PLEASE NOTE: When a member has failed to put their full names and location in their profile, their ads will be deleted WITHOUT NOTICE. You are responsible enough to be involved in firearm activity, so you can be responsible enough to read and understand the forum rules. The posted rules ARE your notice as they are posted throughout the forum. Threads/ads will be restored once a member has updated their profile with first and last name, and state.
2. The Marketplace is intended SOLELY for the mutual benefit of forum members as a resource to support each other's collecting and/or shooting goals.
It is NOT intended for, and will NOT be used by members as a repeated, for-profit venture/operation. This includes:
A. Purchasing items from members on the forum, then posting them for sale at a markup/profit on other commercial sites, i.e. – eBay, Gunbroker, etc.
B. Reselling items at a considerable markup that were recently purchased from CMP.
Members found to have clearly abused this policy will lose the ability to post in and use the Marketplace, and potentially have their forum privileges suspended, temporarily or permanently.
3. You may only list personally owned items, and/or request/WTB items for yourself. “Selling (or buying) this for a friend/family member” ads, and 3rd-party sales/purchases are prohibited.
Additionally, NO posting or linking to listings on eBay, Craigslist, Gunbroker, Reddit, or other outside auction/commercial sites. We will not have the items placed here also. List your product here, try to sell it here, then take it to eBay, Craigslist, Gunbroker, auction-arms, etc.
4. There will be no “auction style” selling here…If you post an item for sale and it says anything like "I will take the highest offer" it will be removed.
We ask that you list your item on just one forum, so there is not confusion and/or issues with an item being sold on another forum when someone attempts to purchase it here. If you do list and sell on another forum, it is your responsibility to immediately update your ad on our forum…if you do not, your privilege to post in the Marketplace and even the forum itself may be suspended, at least temporarily.
NOTE REGARDING 1911 PISTOLS PURCHASED FROM CMP: If you are considering selling a 1911/1911A1 you acquired directly from CMP, you MUST obtain approval from CMP1911ADMIN before listing it on the forum as purchasers of these weapons are not allowed to resell them as a condition of the purchase. You may reach him via PM or email: [email protected]
5. Vendors (or people selling large quantities of the same item as part of a commercial venture) must first contact a moderator or admin.
6. Omission of information is also known as fraud. It is wholly the responsibility of the person listing an item to describe it ACCURATELY and TRUTHFULLY.
Example: If you are selling a rifle stock that has a 9 inch crack in it you need to disclose that information to the buyer. Do not describe the item or tell the buyer that the stock has "light scratches" only.
If we determine that you defraud a member by failing to disclose facts about your items, your access to this section will be restricted and you may be permanently banned from the forum.
7. CLASSIFIED AD REQUIREMENTS
A. Briefly describe your item in the title, along with WTS, WTT or WTB.
B. We do not have any rules regarding notification of a purchase or trade in an ad...it can be accomplished via a post on the thread, a PM, an email, a phone call, a pigeon carrier, etc. However, if you set the terms of your sale, you must follow them! We do not require or enforce any conditions of purchase; however, if a member violates their own terms then they are subject to at least suspension from the Marketplace section. For example: If you say, "First 'I'll take it' gets it," and sell to someone via PM or email without updating your ad and someone posts they'll take it, that's on you. We will not be party to a dispute, but you WILL lose your privilege to post in the Marketplace as a minimum since you failed to follow your own conditions.
C. You must list a price, and make it easily visible, not just lost in the description. Ads without a price will be deleted. It is ok to list a price and OBO (or best offer); however, no auction-style listings
D. As noted in item #4, provide ALL and ACCURATE details. i.e color, size, caliber, year, make, model, condition, defects, etc
E. Post pictures, or at least the links to them. If you are unable to post pics, then make them available via e-mail.
F. List shipping, pick-up or delivery options for the buyer, as well as cost.
G. Be sure to mark your ad as "SOLD" once the items are sold.
8. Do not bump ads older than 90 days without moderator approval. Ads older than 90 days will be locked if they get bumped.
9. Do not bump an ad more than once within a 24-hour period. Ads bumped multiple times within 24 hours will be locked or deleted. Members who continually do this will have their ads locked or deleted, and will lose your privilege to post in the Marketplace.
10. Remove previous bump posts so as to keep the size of the threads to a minimum. Nobody wants to have to search through 4+ pages of "Bump" or "ttt" posts simply to find information on the item listed.
If not removed, mods will remove them and/or delete the thread if it gets out of hand.
11. If you commit to buy or sell, please contact the seller or buyer within 24 hours with a PM or email to make arrangements.
12. If an item is sold, please mark the thread as such. This will help eliminate the old threads coming back up, as well as help those looking for specific items.
13. For WTB items anywhere in the Marketplace:
- Only respond to a WTB ad if you possess the requested item or have specific knowledge of that item’s availability. For example, do not post, “Check eBay” or “Check Gunbroker.”
- Once you have found/purchased the item(s) desired, delete the thread so as to not waste other members' time and allow for other threads to have visibility.
14. Keep the classified threads clean of extraneous/fluff comments and questions, regardless of how innocent or praiseworthy. This prevents derailing the thread and generating wasteful, opinionated discussions, as well as surreptitious bumping of threads.
If you have a technical or knowledge question relating to a listed item, start a new thread or search and add to an existing thread.
If you want to thank or praise a seller or item, DON'T do it in the sale thread as it unnecessarily bumps a stale thread, and said comments will be deleted. Instead, do the person the courtesy of posting in the Buyer/Seller Feedback section here: http://forums.thecmp.org/forumdisplay.php?f=81
Basically, if you don't have a question DIRECTLY related to a sale/trade/purchase of a specific thread, don't post! And this particularly applies to stomping a member’s ad concerning their asking price as there is a tendency to post negative replies when someone lists an item for sale that others consider overpriced.
We will not tolerate members stomping another member's ad concerning their asking price.
This also includes posting low-ball offers. If you want to make an offer lower than the asking price, even if it states OBO, do it via PM or email.
If an item is sold and the listing member deleted the price (which is their prerogative) and you want to know what the price was, do NOT post in the thread…send the member a PM.
Those who continually stomp or hijack other member's ads will face temporary, and even permanent suspension of their forum privileges.
15. No duplicate or multiple threads in different sections for the same item. Pick one section, the most applicable, and post there. Additional duplicate threads will be deleted.
16. You may not use the signature block function to solicit purchases, trades and/or sales. That is why we have the Marketplace...post a thread with your specific WTB, WTS, WTT ad.
You may have up to two lines stating you are looking or searching for a particular rifle/weapon and serial number.
As with individual posts, signature blocks/lines are subject to the same forum rules and will be handled accordingly if they violate any forum rules, policies/procedures or take up too much room of a post.
OTHER TIPS/GUIDELINES
- Buyers and Sellers should verify each other’s identity before sending money and/or products. If possible, get each other’s phone number and have a quick conversation to confirm the transaction details.
- As a suggestion: sellers should consider using delivery confirmation to avoid conflicts from buyers; saying they never received the products.
- Buyers, get to know the seller a little before you blindly send cash. If something does not seem right; it probably isn't. If something seems too good to be true; it probably is. Contact a moderator or report a thread/post that appears to be a scam.
- Respect fellow members. This section is a great place to support/help out fellow members and occasionally make new friends. Please be respectful to your fellow members. Maybe try selling here to a member instead of eBay, maybe save them a buck or two. If you have any questions, problems or concerns feel free to contact a moderator or admin.
- We do not require members to keep ads, or keep a listing price in the thread. It is your ad, so you are free to delete it at your discretion, as well as remove the asking price if you so desire. If someone is curious about the price for what an item sold, contact the seller via PM…do NOT post in thread.
- Lastly, don't forget the <b>Buyer/Seller Feedback section</b> http://forums.thecmp.org/forumdisplay.php?f=81
Be sure to express a good or bad experience with your buyer or seller, and let others know what to expect. Also be sure to check there for a member if you are concerned BEFORE you buy.
MODERATION RULES/ENFORCEMENT
1. All spammers get banned instantly and permanently.
2. Inappropriate or out of hand threads shall be closed with or without reason posted for the closure or deleted at the discretion of the Mods/Admins.
3. If you cannot follow the rules set forth, your posts may be deleted, removed, or edited by the Moderators.
4. If you repeatedly do not follow the rules set forth, you will be banned from this section or from the CMP Forum for any length of time from 2 days to permanently, at the discretion of the Moderators.
NOTE: These rules can change at any time. Administrators and Moderators have the right to make any decision that fits the website and its users.
DISCLAIMER
The CMP, any of its staff and forum administrators/moderators assume NO liability or responsibility for Marketplace transactions. Members will use at their own risk, and CMP will not be responsible for any disputes or claims between members involving a transaction.
The Civilian Marksmanship Program forum is intended primarily to be a technically-oriented website for professional, courteous, and intellectual discussion of CMP matches, activities, firearms and related events. We are an online community founded by enthusiasts, for enthusiasts, of all ages and walks of life. Remember that we have youth CMP participants who view this site. Please enjoy your stay and with your help, we can make the CMP Forums safe for all.
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If you have any questions, please contact a Moderator
Any further updating would have to come from Paladin. (ED NOTE: Paladin is out of business. They had been declining for almost a decade, and the last three years they'd begun to fail entirely. These are NOT industrial histories, and were never intended to be. ) And a friend looked it up. What's on there is, apparently, indeed, from just after the very first printing, back around 1998. Amazon has no deal with me, and I am sure I make nothing from that sort of lashup. Those who have more recent editions and the opportunity to compare will notice that the printings have continuously improved, although only very, very few of the 200 or so updated captions and changes I sent since 2002 has ever been used. Publishers do these things at their convenience. In case someone wonders, the versions of prints they used in the first print were largely the "guide" prints I included with captions attached, never intended to be used IN THE BOOK.
But what's being used there is apparently the oldest extant version.
I know zilch about the kindle version.
Last edited by jimthompson502002; 07-07-2018, 10:35 PM.
Reason: detail
Just got the first chance in a long time to view the very FIRST edition/printing of THE COMPLETE M1 GARAND, and lo and behold, it did indeed contain, on page 1x, the very FIRST introductory page, as a footnote, well BEFORE the first chapter, the below:
"1. What used to be the U.S. Army's DCM (Department of Civilian Marksmanship) has been dissolved, replaced by what is basically a private corporation called the CMP (Civilian Marksmanship Program). Under that umbrella, M1's may go up in price as high as $400 or higher, but will continue to be available. Various auctions, etc., and programs for other firearms may be instituted. The various freezes in the program(s) appear to be over, though it is now more important than ever for the Garand buff to keep a close eye on the system."
Paladin deleted or incorporated my other footnotes, but I did not clearly recall what must've been a last minute change until today!
When I wrote that, this was all quite new. And the book from which I copied that was one I gave away to a friend from the very first printing!
So it--mention of the CMP--was in the book long even before I remembered. Why it wouldn't be in a "Kindle" version... or even if it is absent...I have not the vaguest idea.
Also, there seems to be an inference in some of this that it would've been valid to conceal, soften, or cover up some of the statements made by "old salts" like Jake, which in fact were, if anything, understatements when referring to the smear campaign against the Garand and some aspects of certain manufacturers. That kind of fraudulent propaganda hog wash--the editing out of valid critique and correct information, that is, in favor of whatever commercial interests are paying for advertising, no matter how corrupt--has no place in any kind of literature except advertising handbills. Soft pedaling the information I got would've been not merely dishonest, it would've been criminally irresponsible. Moreover, I've not noticed any disagreement from valid historians or students of the rifle.
I have no idea what a "Kindle" even looks like, or how Amazon might edit what goes on there, nor am I even interested. I have no access, no conversations of any kind with Amazon, no way to input or change anything. But theirs (based on information gleaned from friends) does appear to be weirdly edited and very outdated. I do know the pictures in the book have been upgraded, albeit Paladin has never upgraded most of the captions. But apparently there's something wrong with something that is beyond my capacity to fix. It was my intention NOT to produce an industrial history, which has been done to death before, and to present something from the perspective of the shooter, the 'smith/armorer, and the infantryman, and even to include the reloader. Industrial histories, frankly, bore me to death, and I was far more interested in the sources of exaggerated and fraudulent statements about the Garand in the early days, and I found them. It wasn't even difficult. It's called "vested interests".
I have not read the book in question nor any of the authors work so I really can't comment on the OP's question. I just want to point out something I found, um, interesting in this thread. Please understand this is my own subjective impression and I mean no disrespect to any of the posters in this thread.
The OP started out sounding somewhat dissatisfied with the product he purchased and asked for advice on whether or not he should invest further time to finish reading it. I believe this set the tone for what followed.
On the first page there were 3 neutral replies, 2 negative replies and one reply in support of the product. Then the author of the product in question chimed in and the whole feel of the thread changed.
After that first post by the author we had only one more negative response and seven, count 'em, 7 positive responses supportive of the author and his work with no responses that I would consider neutral or ambiguous in nature.
I find it very interesting to see how the course of the discussion could take such a dramatic turn when the author shows up to defend his work and I wonder just what that says about people in general.
Again, no disrespect intended toward anyone; I'm just making an observation. Please, carry on.
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Don't know what it says about people in general, maybe everyone who read the author's response just understood it a little better then and there were fewer questions. I have one of the first ones published and I have read it so many times, it is getting quite frayed around the corners. I have done reviews on books for several publishers over the last 10 or 15 years and I know what goes into a revision. It can be a daunting project especially if it involves a lot of updated information and pictures.
Having read a lot of your stuff Jim, I do applaud you in your efforts to bring some information to the shooting community. The book in question I thought was a good book and the only thing I wished was different were the pictures, colored ones would be a lot prettier, but again I understand the cost involved and if you can get a point across with a black and white picture then why go through the expense of a colored one. Maybe I am a bit old fashioned but I remember quite well when the pictures in books were all in black and white, that is if they even had pictures.
In summary, thanks Jim for transmitting some good information about the M1 and different aspects of collecting, shooting, reloading, etc.
You obviously did spend considerable time and effort, not to mention the financial cost, in researching this great rifle. I wish I knew you personally and we could go to the range and fire off a few rounds. I always enjoy visiting with and shooting with Garand collectors and shooters.
Have a good one and keep up the good work.
I've read Jim's book "cover to cover" (well, on a Kindle, anyway). The book isn't really designed for an electronic reader, but the price was right ($9). The main issue was trying to tie Jim's comments to the attached pics, but the pics (the Kindle is b/w, and not designed for images) are very hard to discern, and the book's "approach" tends to be Jim stating his comments and confirming them based on the pics in the book. Very, very hard on the electronic reader. It was my first foray into this type of book on the Kindle.
In the end, I did enjoy the book. I kept it in perspective after Jim told me it was an older revision.
Well, as I said earlier, Garand data changes so quickly anymore it's hard for a reference book to be relevant one year after printing. But,this thread has 'Kindled'(HaHa) my interest. I'll have to search out on of Jim's Tomes and purchase it. Obviously, it's from a different slant and should be much better reading.
Figured, as long as this thread discussed "updates", I should mention, in the last month or so, versions of both volumes with improved graphics, a few clarified captions, and a tad more data are now in inventory and in print.
Most of this was stuff that "fell through the cracks" when the project was changed from one rather large volume to a pair of paperbacks.
No interior color, and probably never will be. And I still have almost no information on the Kindle version.
Next printing, the greasing chart will probably reappear, albeit frankly, with the lube points all in the edited Beretta manual, mentioned again elsewhere, and the use of grease stressed repeatedly, it is being reintroduced largely because of a hostile review of which I was reminded.
And there are more notes on the Beretta/Winchester parts which I was beginning to identify by 1998. Yes, those narrow profile gas cylinders marked "PB", as well as the milled trigger guards, are indeed part of the U.S. shipment to Italy, and yes, Winchester is their "original manufacturer". And now it is unanimous: Neither Breda nor Beretta used the legendary but largely fictional Winchester "machines" as anything but a template for constructing their much more modern tooling. These things were all in hand early on, but again, "fell through the cracks". There is now, by the way, much more corroboration.
And again, I never intended them to be industrial histories, albeit they can supplement such volumes.
Last edited by jimthompson502002; 06-26-2019, 06:13 PM.
Reason: spelling
Well... I myself will finally be the happy owner of my first M1 Garand in the next few days. It will be an HRA SG. I had just missed the last batch before they went off the sales page, so I'm really looking forward to it. As such, I will be looking to get some relevant books. I will look into perhaps getting a copy of your most recent printing.
As many said previously, it's cool that you actively participate in the forum. Not everyone gets the privilege to talk directly to authors.
As noted, none of the big vendors will announce ANYTHING. And the 1998 and 2001 dates are introduction dates. It is not in their financial interest to note updates, nor does any other vendor.
I do absolutely nothing on EBAY, and never will. ( UPDATE: After a long absence, in order to help with the sale of an estate with LOTS of camera equipment and optics, I went back on EBAY. I am still there, and as of now, do sell book sets there. However, getting one direct through me, here, is slicker and cleaner.) I do have setups on AuctionArms and GunBroker.
The only Kindle version with which I am familiar is a spinoff of the original 1998 printing of THE COMPLETE M1 GARAND, as discussed elsewhere in this thread. Printings do NOT change the copyright date, they are two entirely separate matters. In short, any Kindle version of which I know is now 14 years out of date, unless it has been changed. And again, no vendor/business will announce revisions or printings, for very obvious reasons already discussed.
Last edited by jimthompson502002; 06-21-2016, 06:42 PM.
Reason: update
On the latest ones, the front sight width chart has been reintroduced, and I suspect they're going to FINALLY get the "grease points" in a sidebar in the manual area.
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