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ADDITIONAL RULES, TO INCLUDE MARKETPLACE/CLASSIFIED AD RULES:
1. Profile Requirements
To start a sale, buy or trade thread anywhere in the Marketplace, your Profile must contain:
A. Your FIRST and LAST name as well as your STATE of residence. Your profile privacy settings must be set to at least allow registered users the ability to view your profile info, i.e. - Not set to "Friends only."
B. You must "enable receive email and PM’s" in your Control panel if you intend to buy or sell.
Additionally, you must have a valid email address listed in your registration profile (which can only be viewed by moderators/admin in the vBulletin master page).
Users with obvious fake names, or using false names in their profile will be permanently removed from the forum without warning. PLEASE NOTE: When a member has failed to put their full names and location in their profile, their ads will be deleted WITHOUT NOTICE. You are responsible enough to be involved in firearm activity, so you can be responsible enough to read and understand the forum rules. The posted rules ARE your notice as they are posted throughout the forum. Threads/ads will be restored once a member has updated their profile with first and last name, and state.
2. The Marketplace is intended SOLELY for the mutual benefit of forum members as a resource to support each other's collecting and/or shooting goals.
It is NOT intended for, and will NOT be used by members as a repeated, for-profit venture/operation. This includes:
A. Purchasing items from members on the forum, then posting them for sale at a markup/profit on other commercial sites, i.e. – eBay, Gunbroker, etc.
B. Reselling items at a considerable markup that were recently purchased from CMP.
Members found to have clearly abused this policy will lose the ability to post in and use the Marketplace, and potentially have their forum privileges suspended, temporarily or permanently.
3. You may only list personally owned items, and/or request/WTB items for yourself. “Selling (or buying) this for a friend/family member” ads, and 3rd-party sales/purchases are prohibited.
Additionally, NO posting or linking to listings on eBay, Craigslist, Gunbroker, Reddit, or other outside auction/commercial sites. We will not have the items placed here also. List your product here, try to sell it here, then take it to eBay, Craigslist, Gunbroker, auction-arms, etc.
4. There will be no “auction style” selling here…If you post an item for sale and it says anything like "I will take the highest offer" it will be removed.
We ask that you list your item on just one forum, so there is not confusion and/or issues with an item being sold on another forum when someone attempts to purchase it here. If you do list and sell on another forum, it is your responsibility to immediately update your ad on our forum…if you do not, your privilege to post in the Marketplace and even the forum itself may be suspended, at least temporarily.
NOTE REGARDING 1911 PISTOLS PURCHASED FROM CMP: If you are considering selling a 1911/1911A1 you acquired directly from CMP, you MUST obtain approval from CMP1911ADMIN before listing it on the forum as purchasers of these weapons are not allowed to resell them as a condition of the purchase. You may reach him via PM or email: [email protected]
5. Vendors (or people selling large quantities of the same item as part of a commercial venture) must first contact a moderator or admin.
6. Omission of information is also known as fraud. It is wholly the responsibility of the person listing an item to describe it ACCURATELY and TRUTHFULLY.
Example: If you are selling a rifle stock that has a 9 inch crack in it you need to disclose that information to the buyer. Do not describe the item or tell the buyer that the stock has "light scratches" only.
If we determine that you defraud a member by failing to disclose facts about your items, your access to this section will be restricted and you may be permanently banned from the forum.
7. CLASSIFIED AD REQUIREMENTS
A. Briefly describe your item in the title, along with WTS, WTT or WTB.
B. We do not have any rules regarding notification of a purchase or trade in an ad...it can be accomplished via a post on the thread, a PM, an email, a phone call, a pigeon carrier, etc. However, if you set the terms of your sale, you must follow them! We do not require or enforce any conditions of purchase; however, if a member violates their own terms then they are subject to at least suspension from the Marketplace section. For example: If you say, "First 'I'll take it' gets it," and sell to someone via PM or email without updating your ad and someone posts they'll take it, that's on you. We will not be party to a dispute, but you WILL lose your privilege to post in the Marketplace as a minimum since you failed to follow your own conditions.
C. You must list a price, and make it easily visible, not just lost in the description. Ads without a price will be deleted. It is ok to list a price and OBO (or best offer); however, no auction-style listings
D. As noted in item #4, provide ALL and ACCURATE details. i.e color, size, caliber, year, make, model, condition, defects, etc
E. Post pictures, or at least the links to them. If you are unable to post pics, then make them available via e-mail.
F. List shipping, pick-up or delivery options for the buyer, as well as cost.
G. Be sure to mark your ad as "SOLD" once the items are sold.
8. Do not bump ads older than 90 days without moderator approval. Ads older than 90 days will be locked if they get bumped.
9. Do not bump an ad more than once within a 24-hour period. Ads bumped multiple times within 24 hours will be locked or deleted. Members who continually do this will have their ads locked or deleted, and will lose your privilege to post in the Marketplace.
10. Remove previous bump posts so as to keep the size of the threads to a minimum. Nobody wants to have to search through 4+ pages of "Bump" or "ttt" posts simply to find information on the item listed.
If not removed, mods will remove them and/or delete the thread if it gets out of hand.
11. If you commit to buy or sell, please contact the seller or buyer within 24 hours with a PM or email to make arrangements.
12. If an item is sold, please mark the thread as such. This will help eliminate the old threads coming back up, as well as help those looking for specific items.
13. For WTB items anywhere in the Marketplace:
- Only respond to a WTB ad if you possess the requested item or have specific knowledge of that item’s availability. For example, do not post, “Check eBay” or “Check Gunbroker.”
- Once you have found/purchased the item(s) desired, delete the thread so as to not waste other members' time and allow for other threads to have visibility.
14. Keep the classified threads clean of extraneous/fluff comments and questions, regardless of how innocent or praiseworthy. This prevents derailing the thread and generating wasteful, opinionated discussions, as well as surreptitious bumping of threads.
If you have a technical or knowledge question relating to a listed item, start a new thread or search and add to an existing thread.
If you want to thank or praise a seller or item, DON'T do it in the sale thread as it unnecessarily bumps a stale thread, and said comments will be deleted. Instead, do the person the courtesy of posting in the Buyer/Seller Feedback section here: http://forums.thecmp.org/forumdisplay.php?f=81
Basically, if you don't have a question DIRECTLY related to a sale/trade/purchase of a specific thread, don't post! And this particularly applies to stomping a member’s ad concerning their asking price as there is a tendency to post negative replies when someone lists an item for sale that others consider overpriced.
We will not tolerate members stomping another member's ad concerning their asking price.
This also includes posting low-ball offers. If you want to make an offer lower than the asking price, even if it states OBO, do it via PM or email.
If an item is sold and the listing member deleted the price (which is their prerogative) and you want to know what the price was, do NOT post in the thread…send the member a PM.
Those who continually stomp or hijack other member's ads will face temporary, and even permanent suspension of their forum privileges.
15. No duplicate or multiple threads in different sections for the same item. Pick one section, the most applicable, and post there. Additional duplicate threads will be deleted.
16. You may not use the signature block function to solicit purchases, trades and/or sales. That is why we have the Marketplace...post a thread with your specific WTB, WTS, WTT ad.
You may have up to two lines stating you are looking or searching for a particular rifle/weapon and serial number.
As with individual posts, signature blocks/lines are subject to the same forum rules and will be handled accordingly if they violate any forum rules, policies/procedures or take up too much room of a post.
OTHER TIPS/GUIDELINES
- Buyers and Sellers should verify each other’s identity before sending money and/or products. If possible, get each other’s phone number and have a quick conversation to confirm the transaction details.
- As a suggestion: sellers should consider using delivery confirmation to avoid conflicts from buyers; saying they never received the products.
- Buyers, get to know the seller a little before you blindly send cash. If something does not seem right; it probably isn't. If something seems too good to be true; it probably is. Contact a moderator or report a thread/post that appears to be a scam.
- Respect fellow members. This section is a great place to support/help out fellow members and occasionally make new friends. Please be respectful to your fellow members. Maybe try selling here to a member instead of eBay, maybe save them a buck or two. If you have any questions, problems or concerns feel free to contact a moderator or admin.
- We do not require members to keep ads, or keep a listing price in the thread. It is your ad, so you are free to delete it at your discretion, as well as remove the asking price if you so desire. If someone is curious about the price for what an item sold, contact the seller via PM…do NOT post in thread.
- Lastly, don't forget the <b>Buyer/Seller Feedback section</b> http://forums.thecmp.org/forumdisplay.php?f=81
Be sure to express a good or bad experience with your buyer or seller, and let others know what to expect. Also be sure to check there for a member if you are concerned BEFORE you buy.
MODERATION RULES/ENFORCEMENT
1. All spammers get banned instantly and permanently.
2. Inappropriate or out of hand threads shall be closed with or without reason posted for the closure or deleted at the discretion of the Mods/Admins.
3. If you cannot follow the rules set forth, your posts may be deleted, removed, or edited by the Moderators.
4. If you repeatedly do not follow the rules set forth, you will be banned from this section or from the CMP Forum for any length of time from 2 days to permanently, at the discretion of the Moderators.
NOTE: These rules can change at any time. Administrators and Moderators have the right to make any decision that fits the website and its users.
DISCLAIMER
The CMP, any of its staff and forum administrators/moderators assume NO liability or responsibility for Marketplace transactions. Members will use at their own risk, and CMP will not be responsible for any disputes or claims between members involving a transaction.
The Civilian Marksmanship Program forum is intended primarily to be a technically-oriented website for professional, courteous, and intellectual discussion of CMP matches, activities, firearms and related events. We are an online community founded by enthusiasts, for enthusiasts, of all ages and walks of life. Remember that we have youth CMP participants who view this site. Please enjoy your stay and with your help, we can make the CMP Forums safe for all.
The opinions and posts on this site do not necessarily reflect those of The Civilian Marksmanship Program.
If you have any questions, please contact a Moderator
OK, so I've been muddling around with the pistol I already have (glock17) and would like to get a pistol that would be more competitive for EIC matches when christmas rolls around. Frankly, my knowledge level about what guns tend to be in the hands of those earning leg points is a little low.
It doesn't need to serve any purpose other than EIC service pistol.....so here it goes.....what would you buy?
(my local range just has 25 for pistol and I'm usually in the 7/8/9s so far....been working on and off on it for a bit)
I would recommend the Springfield Armory Range Officer in .45 ACP. It has great sights and is easily tweaked to do well on the 50 yard line and it won't break the bank like a Les Baer or other custom pistol.
I would recommend the Springfield Armory Range Officer in .45 ACP. It has great sights and is easily tweaked to do well on the 50 yard line and it won't break the bank like a Les Baer or other custom pistol.
Plus its more a legit service pistol than most on the list now.
Service Rifle: 1884-2015 RIP.
Service Pistol: 1903-2014
Plus its more a legit service pistol than most on the list now.
+1 on that. The CMP could have saved match directors a whole lot of confusion by just allowing 1911's like the RO instead of the huge list they came up with.
The RO I got was good out of the box. If they had taken the time to checker the front strap, it would have been perfect. All I had to do was lighten the trigger pull. add a trigger shoe, and install a lighter recoil spring. The barrel to bushing fit was good, but I have heard of some guys installing a NM barrel and bushing.
+1 on that. The CMP could have saved match directors a whole lot of confusion by just allowing 1911's like the RO instead of the huge list they came up with.
I seriously doubt that volunteer match directors ever cross their minds.
Service Rifle: 1884-2015 RIP.
Service Pistol: 1903-2014
The advise given to me by 2112 USMC Team Armorer Isaac McCaskil was to get a Springfield RO, shoot it 5000 times in practice,(and matches) and then bring it to him.
The steel is good in the Springfields, and they have a series 70 trigger that is better for tuning. The RO's have tight stainless bushings, match quality barrels, and adjustable Bo-Mar type sights with a large front sight. They are out of the box capable of taking leg points if you can shoot it at 50 yards. That's where the 5000 rounds comes in. You just can't appreciate the accuracy of a accurized hardball pistol until you can shoot.
Distinguished Rifleman #2198
NRA HP XTC High Master (service rifle)
NRA Patron Life member
PCGC Junior Team coach
CMP GSM Master Inst.
I've seen this question on a few forums and multiple times over the last ~18mos, and the same song seems to play every time... So... I'm going to play my "I'm an ignorant New Guy Card" and ask the dumb question:
What in particular makes the Springfield Range Officer so highly recommended?
Greg's details above are fantastic! I haven't gone through specs on competitor pistols, but I'm surprised to think the SA RO is the only one out there with these attributes/features off of the shelf? Or are they the only ones in their price class?
As some might have seen, I have a SigSauer 1911 Stainless Super Target on hand - will I be better off to buy a Range Officer? With a ~$950 price tag locally, that's a lot of 'smithing work I could do to the Sig, so I'd wanna be sure to understand what the difference really is between the Super Target and the Range Officer which makes the RO highly recommended, and the Sig never even mentioned.
It is surprising how some of these guns are put together
My 1967 Commercial is almost new and probably has no more that 1500 through it. Always kept it clean and lubed. The slide will actually rattle on the frame. That is just the way they went together. I used to shoot PP with it and win. My F.Bob Chow gun is about 65 years old and was shot for 20 years by an Army pistol team member. It is still so tight that it takes effort to take apart. Off a bench I can shoot 3"-4" groups at 50. A good shot could shrink that to half that. Some of these over the counter guns like the RO or SIG are tight as a drum right out of the box. I guess it is the CNC machines and careful assembly with accuracy AND reliability the goal.
The advise given to me by 2112 USMC Team Armorer Isaac McCaskil was to get a Springfield RO, shoot it 5000 times in practice,(and matches) and then bring it to him. The steel is good in the Springfields, and they have a series 70 trigger that is better for tuning. The RO's have tight stainless bushings, match quality barrels, and adjustable Bo-Mar type sights with a large front sight. They are out of the box capable of taking leg points if you can shoot it at 50 yards. That's where the 5000 rounds comes in. You just can't appreciate the accuracy of a accurized hardball pistol until you can shoot.
That's awful advice. You may want to dry fire 5,000 times, but no need to live fire that amount. Money wasted. You would be better off to save the cash from 5,000 rounds and use it to pay for a barrel/bushing, and other required odds/ends. Bushings are not fit, so if yours is tight/loose its simply luck. The barrels are about as "match" as every other company, that's just marketing. The barrels are nearly drop in and undersized, you'll need to have them re-fit or buy a Kart/KKM to have a true match barrel. Mine shot 6" groups until I had a new bushing and my barrel re-fit and 2.5" at 50 yards after that with JHP. Also, FPS/extractor may result in clocking as they're just drop in parts, cheap parts for peace of mind. Another item to watch is the plunger, I've seen several need re-staking.
I've seen this question on a few forums and multiple times over the last ~18mos, and the same song seems to play every time... So... I'm going to play my "I'm an ignorant New Guy Card" and ask the dumb question: What in particular makes the Springfield Range Officer so highly recommended? I haven't gone through specs on competitor pistols, but I'm surprised to think the SA RO is the only one out there with these attributes/features off of the shelf? Or are they the only ones in their price class?
It meets the needs/requirements at the lowest cost. That is why it is so popular. You can use the frame/slide, as a donor as you have funds to accurize the pistol. A full custom would be better/best but very expensive and not required to go distinguished. Springfield Custom, Les Baer (older models), and the rare Kimber Target Match are all better options, but 2 - 3 times the cost.
Will I be better off to buy a Range Officer? With a ~$950 price tag locally, that's a lot of 'smithing work I could do to the Sig, so I'd wanna be sure to understand what the difference really is between the Super Target and the Range Officer which makes the RO highly recommended, and the Sig never even mentioned.
Yes. But the price your quoting is very high. You should be able to get one off the internet delivered for $715. The reason is that stainless cannot have the same slide to frame fit as carbon steel. It will gall/abraid and therefore they are not generally used. If you already have a Sig Sauer, I'd test it to see how accurate it is, you may be in luck and no changes needed You can have a new barrel/bushing and trigger job done and be in more than good enough shape to get leg points. BTW, I'm not sure if those grips are legal on the Sig
I'm pretty sure the Sig Stainless Super Target grips aren't legal, but I don't have any qualms about changing them out. I'll look around for someone with a Ransom to see what the maximum potential of this thing is - I know it's more accurate than I can coax it to be right now.
The price I noted is for the Stainless Range Officer. I'm a stainless guy, but I'm also a revolver guy - if I have to "stoop" to run a carbon steel 1911, I suppose I can do that ;0)
I'm also a tinkerer, do a lot of rifle and revolver smithing (even have to pay Uncle Sam his part), but I've never built a match 1911 - and I'm not naive enough to think I can do it better even than a factory target model, let alone a custom smith. I'm pretty comfortable with the idea of starting out ABOVE entry level so I can be "relatively competitive" if my skill allows. I don't have any delusion of being anything more than a disappointed guy with a gun in a box at the end of matches, but if I can leg out with a $1500 rig, I'd be content to do that. My fervent competitive days are behind me, regardless of the sport. I wanna shoot matches because I love shooting, love competing, and have admired the Distinguished Badge since I was a kid.
But... If I'd struggle to earn leg points considerably moreso with even a fine tuned stainless gun than I would a carbon gun, I'll buy the dang carbon gun!
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