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  #1  
Old 04-18-2019, 06:46 AM
kidthatsirish kidthatsirish is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 28
Default M-1 marked ammunition that just isnt so.

So I noticed during my recent chronographing of both factory and handload ammo that most of the 150 grain ammo marketed as for the M-1 rifle is in fact anywhere from 150-200 fps slower than it shold be (most of the stuff im seeing is in the mid 2600ish fps range)

Granted I know different chronographs give different results, but this trend has been consistent.

I know this is not that big a deal, but just wondering what other folks have noticed or if its just me?
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  #2  
Old 04-18-2019, 09:38 AM
BRMPCF50 BRMPCF50 is offline
 
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Location: Central MO
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I quickly chronographed three different “brands” last year for the Ethiopian 30-06 discussion. Used the LabRadar chrono. Not a big sample.

Chronograph results: Ethiopian 1975, Korean PS 1975, S&B M1 current production

Ethiopian 75 30-06
Total number of shots 16
Average 2865.14 fps
Highest 2916.5 fps
Lowest 2825.25 fps
Ext. Spread 91.25 fps
Std. Dev 29.1 fps

PS 75 30-06
Total number of shots 11
Average 2748.39 fps
Highest 2781.79 fps
Lowest 2685 fps
Ext. Spread 96.79 fps
Std. Dev 26.36 fps

S&B Garand 30-06
Total number of shots 10
Average 2695.22 fps
Highest 2716.72 fps
Lowest 2677.54 fps
Ext. Spread 39.18 fps
Std. Dev 13.18 fps
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  #3  
Old 04-18-2019, 10:05 AM
BRMPCF50 BRMPCF50 is offline
 
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Location: Central MO
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Copy of another chrono report from the Ethiopian thread

For the results I posted earlier the test rifle is a “Blue Sky” M1 Garand mixmaster: pre-war SA 36,xxx receiver, ‘52 barrel, and rebuild agglomeration of other parts.

Results with another rifle, a 1941 Johnson — on another day.

Danish (AMA headstamp) averages 2730 fps. S&B averages 2619.

My general observation is that ammunition gets faster as it ages. There is a great explanation of powder aging in the Norma reloading manual. Storage conditions are also a factor. Heat is the main thing. Keep your ammo cool (and dry). Stick powders age more gracefully than ball (spherical) powders.

My reloads in the high 2400 to low 2600 fps range function well and don’t beat up my old body and old rifles.
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  #4  
Old 04-18-2019, 10:55 AM
Ammolab Ammolab is online now
 
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Do a speed check on USGI 30-06 M2 ball from the 1960s and 70s. It will run 100 to 200fps “slower than it should be”. Most listed commercial and military specs are listed from a “24 test barrel” not a gas ported 22” rifle.

I think the modern M1 safe ammo loads are just about right.

Also many state ball powder is more stable in loaded rounds over time for storage. Norma states other wise?

Last edited by Ammolab; 04-18-2019 at 11:01 AM.
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  #5  
Old 04-18-2019, 11:28 AM
613jmm 613jmm is offline
 
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Location: Jacksonville, NC
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I believe it is being marketed as "M1 ammo" because it is supposed to be M1 "safe" not because it is supposed to meet M2 ammo specification.

And as was stated earlier, their stated velocity claims are using test barrels, not to mention their equipment, and most likely in ideal conditions.
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  #6  
Old 04-18-2019, 11:51 AM
Gewehr43 Gewehr43 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 613jmm View Post
I believe it is being marketed as "M1 ammo" because it is supposed to be M1 "safe" not because it is supposed to meet M2 ammo specification.

And as was stated earlier, their stated velocity claims are using test barrels, not to mention their equipment, and most likely in ideal conditions.
This...….. "I believe it is being marketed as "M1 ammo" because it is supposed to be M1 "safe" not because it is supposed to meet M2 ammo specification...…."
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  #7  
Old 04-20-2019, 01:55 PM
kidthatsirish kidthatsirish is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ammolab View Post
Do a speed check on USGI 30-06 M2 ball from the 1960s and 70s. It will run 100 to 200fps “slower than it should be”. Most listed commercial and military specs are listed from a “24 test barrel” not a gas ported 22” rifle.

I think the modern M1 safe ammo loads are just about right.

Also many state ball powder is more stable in loaded rounds over time for storage. Norma states other wise?

i did a chrono check on several m2 ball surplas loads...most were in the high 27s to low 28s, with the exception of LC69...that was a bit slow.

Either way I suppose the marketing ad truly is about being M-1 safe, not so much a m2 ball duplicate, although most of its pretty close (i doubt a person or target could tell the difference when shot!)
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  #8  
Old 05-24-2019, 08:42 PM
Dusty31 Dusty31 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Nebraska
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I've found about half of factory ammo fails to meet the advertised velocity. I'd also guess the advertised velocity of "garand safe" ammo didn't come from a garand, but from a bench mounted bolt gun.
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  #9  
Old 05-26-2019, 09:43 PM
pickax pickax is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Daytona Beach Fla.
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Ericc did as complete study with the right instruments a few years ago, developing his barrel port plug.
He brought all info to this forum seeking input, and it may be searchable.
This from his website, albeit getting dated on commercial ammo.
http://www.garandgear.com/m1-garand-ammunition.

I'm not surprised newer "Garand safe" ammo is downloaded.
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