Go Back   CMP Forums > CMP Sales > M1A/M14
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 08-21-2017, 07:53 PM
fkienast fkienast is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 146
Default

Two things I'd like to know:
1. How did it shoot prior to being upgraded to NM specs?
2. Exactly what worked was performed to bring it to NM specs?
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-22-2017, 05:37 PM
CriterionBarrels CriterionBarrels is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 61
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by M14 View Post
As long as your rear sight knobs and screws are tight, it cannot jack down if the rear sight spring dust cover is in the proper place and the receiver is to spec. Not unless it has all the gear cogs stripped off it first.

Easy enough to check it though when firing. Just make a note of where the tick mark is pointing and which meter number it is on. When the rounds start hitting low, look and see if the elevation marks have moved from where they were.

I hate to say this, but these symptoms scream of a barrel that had the bore center drilled crooked during the deep bore drilling process at the factory. Classic example of a cold bore wanderer barrel.

They use to drive John Krieger nuts until he found the problem causing it. At one time they had an almost 30% waste rate on deep bore drilling of barrels and is how Criterion came into being, to sell off the ones that were waste or weren't good enough to cut rifle. So as to preserve the good Krieger name in barrel making. Then later during an interview, he claimed that Krieger had no association with Criterion at all, never had. The journalist was quick to point out that in an earlier interview he had stated that they formed Criterion and were button rifling barrels too....and they were in the same building at first !
Hey, if it's a lie, the journalist told it, not me, just relaying what I read.

Just in case, check the flash suppressor and make sure it is tight and you are not getting bullet strikes. You can usually feel and hear those though. You can see if it has brass marks inside the suppressor, if it is.

If you check all this, and it persist, send it back to SAI.
The above commentary regarding the relationship between Criterion and Krieger Barrels is 100% incorrect. Criterion and Krieger have always been two separate entities. Krieger was initially approached by Weatherby to produce barrels for their Mark V barrel line, and were unable to accommodate the level of demand required. Criterion's founder and President (Steve Dahlke) purchased his own machinery and initially occupied floor space in the Krieger building, but ownership and operation of the company has always been separate.

Criterion was founded to accommodate that demand by offering a button rifled alternative to Krieger to premium rifle manufacturers (and more recently individual custom rifle builders).

Criterion was never sold and was never given scrap material or blemished barrels from Krieger. We take great care in the quality of our work, and in maintaining the those extremely tight tolerances in production. We too scrap out barrels that do not meet our criteria regarding product design and performance. There are a number of steps carried out in our production process specifically designed to eliminate the possibility of runout or a crooked bore during and after the drilling process.

But don't just take my word for it. Our track record at the National Matches, as well as a number of national records set in various different disciplines speaks for itself. Read consumer reviews and see how our barrels have stacked up when compared to our competition. I encourage rifle builders to be active in researching product reviews rather than simply accepting third party heresay at face value.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-22-2017, 07:09 PM
nf1e nf1e is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,281
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CriterionBarrels View Post
The above commentary regarding the relationship between Criterion and Krieger Barrels is 100% incorrect. Criterion and Krieger have always been two separate entities. Krieger was initially approached by Weatherby to produce barrels for their Mark V barrel line, and were unable to accommodate the level of demand required. Criterion's founder and President (Steve Dahlke) purchased his own machinery and initially occupied floor space in the Krieger building, but ownership and operation of the company has always been separate.

Criterion was founded to accommodate that demand by offering a button rifled alternative to Krieger to premium rifle manufacturers (and more recently individual custom rifle builders).

Criterion was never sold and was never given scrap material or blemished barrels from Krieger. We take great care in the quality of our work, and in maintaining the those extremely tight tolerances in production. We too scrap out barrels that do not meet our criteria regarding product design and performance. There are a number of steps carried out in our production process specifically designed to eliminate the possibility of runout or a crooked bore during and after the drilling process.

But don't just take my word for it. Our track record at the National Matches, as well as a number of national records set in various different disciplines speaks for itself. Read consumer reviews and see how our barrels have stacked up when compared to our competition. I encourage rifle builders to be active in researching product reviews rather than simply accepting third party heresay at face value.
Thank you CriterionBarrels.
Very pleased to use Criterion barrels.
The individual that made the uninformed post you quoted is well known for promulgating mis-information. People that know him personally say " he means well but just can't help himself".
Let us hope he will man up, step up to the plate and post a full retraction.

Semper Fi
Art

Last edited by nf1e; 08-22-2017 at 07:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-22-2017, 08:57 PM
Roadkingtrax Roadkingtrax is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 8,249
Default

So its you...not the barrel?
__________________
"The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction." ~William Blake
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-23-2017, 09:45 AM
Short Round Short Round is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 811
Default

Repeat your test writing down your clicks of elevation. At the appearance of the problem count your clicks up from the bottom again. If you're several clicks different you have a sight problem.

If your sight is fine then you have a bedding issue that is showing up with barrel heat. I have seen ugly moves with Garands and wedged rear handguard. Shouldn't really crop up with an M14 Fiberglas handguard unless the edges are resting tightly on the forestock.

Your unitized gas cylinder could have been made poorly with the retainer causing a bind instead of holding the handguard up off the forestock.

Other than a loose sight look at heat and contact issues.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-23-2017, 07:58 PM
Don in SC Don in SC is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Up state South Carolina
Posts: 1,416
Default

May not be the rifle or the ammo, could be the shooter, if your position is not solid your body to rifle relation will change and so will the POI for each shot.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-24-2017, 08:58 PM
Ohio Don Ohio Don is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: S Florida and SE Ohio
Posts: 3,674
Default

Have another shooter try the rifle. If it still has problems, it is the rifle. If it doesn't, then it is the shooter.
__________________
NRA Life member
NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,RSO
US Army Transportation and Medical Corps Museums Life member
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-27-2017, 08:27 AM
M14 M14 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: south mississippi
Posts: 766
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CriterionBarrels View Post
The above commentary regarding the relationship between Criterion and Krieger Barrels is 100% incorrect. Criterion and Krieger have always been two separate entities. Krieger was initially approached by Weatherby to produce barrels for their Mark V barrel line, and were unable to accommodate the level of demand required. Criterion's founder and President (Steve Dahlke) purchased his own machinery and initially occupied floor space in the Krieger building, but ownership and operation of the company has always been separate.

Criterion was founded to accommodate that demand by offering a button rifled alternative to Krieger to premium rifle manufacturers (and more recently individual custom rifle builders).

Criterion was never sold and was never given scrap material or blemished barrels from Krieger. We take great care in the quality of our work, and in maintaining the those extremely tight tolerances in production. We too scrap out barrels that do not meet our criteria regarding product design and performance. There are a number of steps carried out in our production process specifically designed to eliminate the possibility of runout or a crooked bore during and after the drilling process.

But don't just take my word for it. Our track record at the National Matches, as well as a number of national records set in various different disciplines speaks for itself. Read consumer reviews and see how our barrels have stacked up when compared to our competition. I encourage rifle builders to be active in researching product reviews rather than simply accepting third party heresay at face value.
Thank you for clearing that up. I didn't believe it when I read it, that's why I added this....if it's a lie, the journalist told it, not me, just relaying what I read.

The point I was trying to make for the OP, is the off center bore affects on a barrel and it's accuracy, any barrel. Krieger was just an example to get my point across. Then I remembered the article I read. Now we know they didn't give them to Criterion, according to Criterion.

I'm well aware of Criterion's stellar record at the matches. You don't get that kind of a record through the years by turning out seconds. Only top quality barrels will post those scores, in the hands of a proficient competitor.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 08-27-2017, 09:25 AM
hemmingsenm hemmingsenm is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The thumb of Michigan
Posts: 189
Default

I shot strings both using a sling and a bench rest. The results were the same. If the problem was me, the shooter, I would have expected different results. I sent it back to Springfield a couple days ago. I will let you know what they decide to do. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 08-29-2017, 10:53 PM
mac1911 mac1911 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,352
Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by CriterionBarrels View Post
The above commentary regarding the relationship between Criterion and Krieger Barrels is 100% incorrect. Criterion and Krieger have always been two separate entities. Krieger was initially approached by Weatherby to produce barrels for their Mark V barrel line, and were unable to accommodate the level of demand required. Criterion's founder and President (Steve Dahlke) purchased his own machinery and initially occupied floor space in the Krieger building, but ownership and operation of the company has always been separate.

Criterion was founded to accommodate that demand by offering a button rifled alternative to Krieger to premium rifle manufacturers (and more recently individual custom rifle builders).

Criterion was never sold and was never given scrap material or blemished barrels from Krieger. We take great care in the quality of our work, and in maintaining the those extremely tight tolerances in production. We too scrap out barrels that do not meet our criteria regarding product design and performance. There are a number of steps carried out in our production process specifically designed to eliminate the possibility of runout or a crooked bore during and after the drilling process.

But don't just take my word for it. Our track record at the National Matches, as well as a number of national records set in various different disciplines speaks for itself. Read consumer reviews and see how our barrels have stacked up when compared to our competition. I encourage rifle builders to be active in researching product reviews rather than simply accepting third party heresay at face value.
funny I just email Criterion about factory 2nd barrels as I was worried by price alone a certain vendor might be selling factory 2nds....but now im thinking could they be stamping fake criterion markings on them ?
PS I received a very quick response to my email from criterion. They stated they do not sell factory seconds for retail.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:35 PM.