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  #11  
Old 09-13-2018, 09:28 PM
FLD FLD is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snipershot1944 View Post
Agreed, but I'd feel a lot better about things if the bidders have to get their paperwork in during the same time frame as us common folk.
They do. The winning bidder has to submit a completed and correct packet and pass the background check before the pistol is shipped.
The other side of the coin is this; if I end up with a relatively high number and I don't want to wait until a future allotment, I may be more inclined to bid on an auction.

Last edited by FLD; 09-13-2018 at 09:34 PM.
  #12  
Old 09-14-2018, 07:58 AM
snipershot1944 snipershot1944 is offline
 
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Actually, it was earlier posted by CMP1911admin yesterday that a bidder does not have to submit a package until after they win the auction, not during the 30-day window like those of us using the lottery option.
  #13  
Old 09-14-2018, 08:15 AM
snipershot1944 snipershot1944 is offline
 
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reply to cmp1911admin.

I guess I'm following two thought paths. Many of us have gone through a lot of trouble to "jump through the hoops" specified by CMP to get a correct package in on time during the very narrow 30-day window specified to be able to purchase one of these pistols using the lottery option. To allow the folks using the auction to submit their packages at any time, outside the 30-day window just seems unfair to me. It's like cutting the line for a movie or concert where there are limited seats.

Also, more importantly, it's a numbers game. CMP has about 8000 pistols now, and might get up to 100,000 over an 8-12 year basis. So you have a fixed number of pistols. With the use of the 30-day window to submit packages, you also then have a fixed number of people who can buy the pistols. If you allow packages to be submitted after the 30 day window for those who buy using the auction option, the number of people who are allowed to buy is no longer fixed, it's increased. At the end of the process, on a 1:1 basis, those allowed to submit their paperwork outside of the 30-day window will knock off one applicant who has waited patiently in line for months or year.
  #14  
Old 09-14-2018, 08:38 AM
Avman81 Avman81 is offline
 
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Isn't CMP1911 processing the 1911's received and making a determination of which pistols will be available for the lottery and which will be available to the auction site? If so, then there are two different universes of pistols available for purchase that are interconnected only by the paperwork requirements. If you submitted for a lottery pistol and end up purchasing an auction pistol, you lose your lottery standing. If you get a lottery pistol, you cannot get an auction pistol. That seems fair.

Conversely, the way I see it from your point of view, if all interested parties submitted now, then only those who submitted could either get a lottery pistol or bid on the auction and no one else. That keeps the universe of bidders as a fixed number. You need to remember that as these pistols are released from the Army to CMP, the process repeats itself. CMP will not know the quality of the items until received, and will now know quantities available for either lottery or auction until they have gone through them.

I have my lottery packet in. I love looking at the auction items, but unfortunately for me, I do not have enough disposable income to afford most of those items. I am almost certain it will that way for the 1911s as well.
  #15  
Old 09-14-2018, 08:42 AM
brianm423 brianm423 is offline
 
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With any auction item, whoever is the winning bidder submits their packet AFTER auction closes. CMP gives you 30 days to submit packet for auction. So in this case with the 1911s, if any are auctioned (I'm sure there will be some), they are going to sell for way more than the service grade price of a $1k. I think that warrants the winning bidder, who might not have sent in a packet during the standard window, to submit their packet at that time. If you want to guarantee yourself a pistol and not deal with the lottery, then I would plan to dish out some cash for an auction item. Just like any other rare firearm that comes through the CMP channels.
  #16  
Old 09-14-2018, 08:46 AM
rgdguns rgdguns is online now
 
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It is a pay to play world from the airlines to hotels and amusement parks almost everywhere if you are willing to pay you get to jump the line. That being said the buyers of the auction guns may not even be interested in a lottery gun so why flood the system with extra packets if not needed.

Who said that they will have anything for the auction they are still evaluating the guns?

Last edited by rgdguns; 09-14-2018 at 08:48 AM.
  #17  
Old 09-14-2018, 08:48 AM
RazorBurn RazorBurn is offline
 
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I look at the auctions as separate from the mail order items available from the CMP. Most of the time the items on auction are rarer and harder to find, and even when a more common items show up on the auctions tend to bring more money than they really should. I think there are a couple of reasons for this. People are using the auctions as a way to donate to the CMP, and of course you always have people who get into bidding wars.

I myself don't have a problem with the auctions being a separate order packet because I bet you dollars to doughnuts there will be quite a few non-paying bidders. No need for the CMP to go through more paperwork for someone who isn't going to complete the auction process IMHO. People get caught up in the moment in a bidding war, and then don't follow through. We've all seen it happen on the CMP, eBay and Gunbroker.
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  #18  
Old 09-14-2018, 09:23 AM
Smokie Smokie is offline
 
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I would think the lottery is for the three (3) grades (service, field and rack) that winners will be able to choose from once called or notified they are a winner. The auction items are just like the CMP auctions it listed now, Collector, correct or limited quantity. The process in place seems more than fair. The window for filling out a packet opened in June (60 days ahead of mailing window) so that seems more than enough time.
  #19  
Old 09-14-2018, 09:31 AM
SEANinMICH SEANinMICH is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snipershot1944 View Post
Many of us have gone through a lot of trouble to "jump through the hoops" specified by CMP to get a correct package in on time during the very narrow 30-day window specified to be able to purchase one of these pistols using the lottery option.
What is required could hardly be considered "jumping through hoops". Anyone purchasing an auction item will also have to complete all the same information. In what century is a 30 day window for mail delivery "narrow"? Are you sending your package by horseback messenger?

Quote:
Originally Posted by snipershot1944 View Post
To allow the folks using the auction to submit their packages at any time, outside the 30-day window just seems unfair to me. It's like cutting the line for a movie or concert where there are limited seats.
Those auction folks are also going to be paying 2-3 times more than the lottery folks. I guess that's not fair, either. Maybe CMP should just start pricing at $2000 for rackers and skip the auction all together. Then it would be "fair"


Quote:
Originally Posted by snipershot1944 View Post
Also, more importantly, it's a numbers game. CMP has about 8000 pistols now, and might get up to 100,000 over an 8-12 year basis. So you have a fixed number of pistols. With the use of the 30-day window to submit packages, you also then have a fixed number of people who can buy the pistols. If you allow packages to be submitted after the 30 day window for those who buy using the auction option, the number of people who are allowed to buy is no longer fixed, it's increased. At the end of the process, on a 1:1 basis, those allowed to submit their paperwork outside of the 30-day window will knock off one applicant who has waited patiently in line for months or year.
Huh?? It's one pistol per LIFETIME. The number of people that can purchase is absolutely limited to exactly the number of pistols received. items going to auction are going no matter what. They aren't going to be part of the lottery sales, so no one "patiently waiting" has been skipped over at all. If someone that is waiting doesn't want to wait anymore, they can go ahead and purchase their once in a lifetime pistol on auction.
  #20  
Old 09-14-2018, 09:53 AM
Blacksmith Blacksmith is offline
 
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The primary purpose of CMP firearm sales is to make money to fund the many other programs they have. They are doing a good job of balancing the funding goal with the effort to fairly distribute the firearms to people who will use them to promote civilian marksmanship.

In my dealings with CMP I have been both lucky and unlucky but have always been satisfied. Life is not fair but the CMP is (IMHO).
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