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  #21  
Old 12-08-2009, 08:43 AM
CadillacMike CadillacMike is offline
 
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Location: Tampa Bay FL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stockyards brat View Post
Although you can't have an AR in the PRNJ (MOVE!!!) this is where the AR shines. A standard 55 gr SP,-not a HP- will not exit a body, an exterior wall or ricochet (hope thats right-no spell checker). Mini 14 maybe? Police entry teams are switching from pistol cal subs to M-4s just for this reason, and maybe a little more stopping power.
Note, M4 and M16A2s and later use heavier bullets, 62, 65 or 68gr, the 55gr is passe.
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  #22  
Old 12-08-2009, 01:55 PM
cuppednlocked cuppednlocked is offline
 
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Location: Triangle, NC
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If $$$ is tight, get a used Remington 870 or Mossberg 500. You can find used "police" models of the 870 that would be perfect for what you're looking for (short barrel/easy to use in tight spaces). With the wide range of potential projectiles (bird, buck, slugs) the shotgun can adapt to the problem at hand. You also have more leverage with a carbine length weapon (over a pistol) if it gets to that...

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepsi71ocean View Post
Ide rather have a 15 round burp gun then a single shot pump shotgun, which the ones we have are also unwieldy as well.
15 rounds that don't hit the target will do nothing for you other than leave you with an empty weapon.

You have a MUCH greater chance of hitting your target with multiple projectiles with the shotgun than your "burp gun".
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  #23  
Old 12-08-2009, 03:45 PM
scr83jp scr83jp is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: california
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepsi71ocean View Post
We had another scare lately, where we had prisoners break out of the local police Barracks, and the police went looking. As typical our barracks are the holding point for most of the criminals heading up to Toms River where the county Jail is.

Anyways without my dad home i had no choice but to load my M1A with 150gr Prvi Partizan Soft point ammo. If i had 30-06 SP ammo i would have loaded the Garand.

My question is since it is a soft point will it be stopped by a human body if someone came in to the house, and was shot within 15 feet(give or take).

The problem is, the last time(time before) the the guy who broke out stole weapons from the barracks and was armed as he ran around the town, so its not so easy as a unarmed prisoner.

Im worried about the bullet going through him and through the walls, and 300 feet away across the woods the street and hitting a neighbor, etic.
A 12g shotgun with a field load of #5's or #6's will turn a human chest & abdomen into mush according to the morgue reports I read on police reports of cases I was assigned as an investigating probation officer.Bird shot really tears humans up at close range.I'm a long time reloader and hunter so some of the 12g ammo I've loaded with 1 1/4oz of 4's,5's,6's or 7 1/2's for use in my Rem 870 with a 30" full choked trap barrel will reach out a hundred yards .
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  #24  
Old 12-11-2009, 11:14 PM
Phoenix7 Phoenix7 is offline
 
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Location: Gillette, WY
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Don't take this as me encouraging you to actually take the shot, but whatever you load the gun with, make sure they are FACTORY PRODUCED rounds. This is to save your a$$ if you have to use it, so the load can be duplicated (once you shoot a handload, you have no way of proving what was in it otherwise). There was a long drawn out case about this, I just wish I remember where I found it. Secondly, make sure you're not too attached to whatever gun you pick up either, because it'll probably be in evidence for 6 months afterward (but at least you're alive).

I second the notion of a shotgun (if you're not too keen on pumps, you can always get a semi-auto). As far as penetration is concerned, if it won't penetrate a wall, it probably won't penetrate far enough to hit the vitals to stop a goblin either...and overpenetration doesn't account for shots that you miss... (don't miss btw...) And IMO, bird shot is for little birds.
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  #25  
Old 12-13-2009, 12:37 AM
Stockyards brat Stockyards brat is offline
 
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Location: Ft. Worth, TEXAS!!!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CadillacMike View Post
Note, M4 and M16A2s and later use heavier bullets, 62, 65 or 68gr, the 55gr is passe.
We're not military, or at least I'm not. We can load with anything we choose. Also, the advice on using only factory ammo is right on. An anti-gun DA, as well as the plantiff's attorney in the almost sure to happen civil suit (Even if the use of lethal force was justified) will crucify you for using re-loads. Read Massad Ayoub's articles on lethal force use.
My choices:
Primary-Glock 22 (.40) with Meprolight sights & Streamlight TLR-1 light, loaded with Win Ranger 155 gr. Note that choice is "What the cops use".

Secondary-Rem 1100 with 22" rifle sighted remchoke bbl and Imp Cyl tube (tested the best with chosen ammo-Win 00 buck 12 pellet loads) Surefire forend with light, Meprolight sights, Side saddle carrier and extended mag.

Third layer-Flat top CAR 15 with Surefire 120 lumen weapon light mounted on sight tower, Aimpoint 1x dot sight (4 min) with BUIS and 2-30 rnd mags in mag cinchs loaded with Black Hills 55 gr soft points. Things would have to get very bad to get this far.
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  #26  
Old 12-13-2009, 06:01 PM
pepsi71ocean pepsi71ocean is offline
 
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ive looked into a Ruger Mini-14, and a Jersey legal AR-15, my brother wants to split for the AR, but sadly neither are in inventory at any gun stores around here, especially the Mini-14 which i prefer over the AR.

im sure a wall or even glass windows(double payne) would stop a .223 SP am i correct?
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  #27  
Old 12-14-2009, 12:06 PM
Stockyards brat Stockyards brat is offline
 
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Location: Ft. Worth, TEXAS!!!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepsi71ocean View Post
ive looked into a Ruger Mini-14, and a Jersey legal AR-15, my brother wants to split for the AR, but sadly neither are in inventory at any gun stores around here, especially the Mini-14 which i prefer over the AR.

im sure a wall or even glass windows(double payne) would stop a .223 SP am i correct?
Residential window glass won't stop anything except maybe a BB, but even that is iffy. Sheetrock, insulation, exterior wall cladding and then the siding will seriously deform a .223 sp, if not completly stop it.
You might want to look at frangible bullets. By the way, does the NJ hollowpoint ban apply to rifles also?
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  #28  
Old 12-14-2009, 06:36 PM
mopardoctor mopardoctor is offline
 
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Location: Barney Fife, Wa
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I made up a impact rack from 10-2 x 8 boards stacked together when I taught Hunter Ed. This didn't really cover the hunting subject but I thought that home firearm safety was important also. Boards were spaced by 2x4 distance (1-5/8) and held together by 1x8 on top and bottom. We set this impact rack up on a workmate and started shooting different ammo through it at 25 feet. 150 grain 30 cal FMJ went through all 10 boards and kept on going. 150 grain SP 30/06 went through 6. 30/30 went through 4. 44 Mag went through 2. 12 gauge 00 buck 12 pellet Magnum load busted the first board and stuck in the second (.35 dia. shot). #6 12 gauge turned the first board impact point into sawdust. In my opinion #6 or #4 shot is the proper choice for a home defense round. It could be any gauge - 12,16,20, or 28. I think The Rifleman did an article on wall pentration a few years ago and a 12 g. #6 would not go through a test section of a wall(sheet rock on both sides). This might be important if you live in an apartment. Also, the perp is going to have a bloody problem, it is hard to sew up hamburger, which the entry wound is going to look like.
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  #29  
Old 12-15-2009, 08:39 AM
cannonshooter cannonshooter is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New York
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pepsi,
have you tried sayerville sportsman? the last time i was in they had a very good selection and if they dont have it they can get it. also rosebank sports on staten island i know has mini 14s in stock. if interested pm me and ill give you the phone numbers.
matt
usmc 1988-1995
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  #30  
Old 12-16-2009, 08:26 PM
pepsi71ocean pepsi71ocean is offline
 
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Location: The United Soviet Republic of South Jersey
Posts: 575
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i called into my local gun shop today and bam there was a Mini 14 there, but they wanted 850 for it, seems like a big price, but does this seem like its fair?

and yea send those numbers over if its cheaper by a hundred or so then it might be worth a drive up.
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