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  #61  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:10 PM
Paladin601 Paladin601 is offline
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Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
By golly, the light just came on. Cast is for the greenies. Energy efficient weaponry. Thanks Paladin601. You just made my day.
Semper Fi
Art
well when making large number of weapon, energy figures into cost. And it is investment cast which is very different to green sand or lost wax casting. Quite a few people just don't realize the difference.

But then there are quite a few people who think welding pipes together is the saame as precision welding, but that is another story.

Last edited by Paladin601; 09-25-2012 at 11:14 PM.
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  #62  
Old 09-26-2012, 12:09 AM
nf1e nf1e is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Paladin601 View Post
well when making large number of weapon, energy figures into cost. And it is investment cast which is very different to green sand or lost wax casting. Quite a few people just don't realize the difference.

But then there are quite a few people who think welding pipes together is the saame as precision welding, but that is another story.
I was serious, you made my day. Last day on vacation in Hawaii and thoughts of going home to frost had me a little down. I did see a bit of humor in Green rifles. Thanks
Makes complete sense. As long as they work.
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  #63  
Old 09-26-2012, 09:37 AM
M14 M14 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by mwhite49 View Post
M14, I like the way you scored them. Easy to figure out. If every major that visits this site did that everyone would be ahead of the Game. I called Fultons today and talked to a fellow about the actions. I asked point blank if when they build up a rifle does every bolt have to be lapped? He said no, a small percentage. He did say that they have a really good quality control program.
Mike
Thank you. I was trying to think of some way to do it for awhile now. The critical issues that preclude a novice from building one successfully, seemed to be the best way. Even with those walls to slow one down, they may still be completed with patience and common sense, and a few tools invested in.

When I speak about problems from maker to maker, I speak in broad generalizations about each. Listing all problems found at any given time in one makers receivers, does not mean that every receiver has all those problems at once. Although, I have seen receivers with all problems at once. Those are the ones you really wish you would have sent back. But I struggled through completing the long duration builds, and still came out with really nice rifles that fire consistently accurate, and will no doubt last a lifetime.

The more I converse with Clint Jr., the more I like him. He seems genuinely dedicated to getting it right. If you use a bolt of their's, and a receiver, you have a better chance at minimal or no lapping, compared to other makers. The last rear lugged I did with their combo of parts, had contact on both sides. The left was maybe 10% contact and the right was 40%, so I elected to lap a little, as I had ample room for headspace before finish reaming. Geeck is arriving this Saturday so we can do a rear lug build from Fulton for his #2 competition rifle. With his permission, I will post how it goes, or ask him to do so. His #1 is a 762MM Firearms, and has held it's own in many competitions to date. He is now placing in the money in many places he goes to shoot with it. He partners up with Bamban in pair firings and the instances of his humility are becoming less and less with each outing.

The important thing about contact, is not how much you have, but the relationship of the receiver lugs to the bolt lugs, dimensionally speaking. In other words, how perpindicular and squared to each other's faces they are.
If you have a left lug face on the receiver that is cut in an odd, or off angle, to the bolt lug when in battery, it will require more % of contact and lapping. Lately, in this regard, Fulton has surpassed all others, in my opinion and from my experience with all makers. I did not include SEI, because I have not done one of their new ones yet, and only worked a few of their older ones. I only owned one of their old ones for a short time, and then Cheepertokeepher talked me out of it, he is a lucky dog and a great guy! I regretted selling it the moment it left here, but knew it went to a good home and guy.
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  #64  
Old 09-26-2012, 09:49 AM
Hawk Hawk is offline
 
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Great explanation. Thanx
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  #65  
Old 09-26-2012, 11:28 AM
nf1e nf1e is offline
 
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Location: Connecticut
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M14 View Post
Thank you. I was trying to think of some way to do it for awhile now. The critical issues that preclude a novice from building one successfully, seemed to be the best way. Even with those walls to slow one down, they may still be completed with patience and common sense, and a few tools invested in.

When I speak about problems from maker to maker, I speak in broad generalizations about each. Listing all problems found at any given time in one makers receivers, does not mean that every receiver has all those problems at once. Although, I have seen receivers with all problems at once. Those are the ones you really wish you would have sent back. But I struggled through completing the long duration builds, and still came out with really nice rifles that fire consistently accurate, and will no doubt last a lifetime.

The more I converse with Clint Jr., the more I like him. He seems genuinely dedicated to getting it right. If you use a bolt of their's, and a receiver, you have a better chance at minimal or no lapping, compared to other makers. The last rear lugged I did with their combo of parts, had contact on both sides. The left was maybe 10% contact and the right was 40%, so I elected to lap a little, as I had ample room for headspace before finish reaming. Geeck is arriving this Saturday so we can do a rear lug build from Fulton for his #2 competition rifle. With his permission, I will post how it goes, or ask him to do so. His #1 is a 762MM Firearms, and has held it's own in many competitions to date. He is now placing in the money in many places he goes to shoot with it. He partners up with Bamban in pair firings and the instances of his humility are becoming less and less with each outing.

The important thing about contact, is not how much you have, but the relationship of the receiver lugs to the bolt lugs, dimensionally speaking. In other words, how perpindicular and squared to each other's faces they are.
If you have a left lug face on the receiver that is cut in an odd, or off angle, to the bolt lug when in battery, it will require more % of contact and lapping. Lately, in this regard, Fulton has surpassed all others, in my opinion and from my experience with all makers. I did not include SEI, because I have not done one of their new ones yet, and only worked a few of their older ones. I only owned one of their old ones for a short time, and then Cheepertokeepher talked me out of it, he is a lucky dog and a great guy! I regretted selling it the moment it left here, but knew it went to a good home and guy.
Rip, thanks for your contribution. Your descriptions of receiver grading is super.Keep it up. Perhaps you should write a book. HE HE
Semper Fi
Art
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  #66  
Old 09-26-2012, 11:31 AM
mwhite49 mwhite49 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 114
Default M14 actions

For the heck of it I just called 7.62 and talked to a person, not sure who but Chris was not in. I asked what they would charge to install my TRW bolt and my Douglas barrel on one of the forged actions. His response blew me away. It is 100% free. Now that's customer service with a smile. I had been leaning towards Fultons but now with a basicaly free build thrown in you can't go wrong.
Mike
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  #67  
Old 09-26-2012, 11:35 AM
Fogtripper Fogtripper is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mwhite49 View Post
7.62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwhite49 View Post
can't go wrong.
Ho boy.
Out of all of the manufacturers that have been discussed in this thread, the one that I would never ever send money and/or parts to is 7.62. I've lived vicariously through the threads created by the unhappy customers.

Last edited by Fogtripper; 09-26-2012 at 11:38 AM.
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  #68  
Old 09-26-2012, 12:03 PM
ramit ramit is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,235
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M14 View Post
Thank you. I was trying to think of some way to do it for awhile now. The critical issues that preclude a novice from building one successfully, seemed to be the best way. Even with those walls to slow one down, they may still be completed with patience and common sense, and a few tools invested in.

When I speak about problems from maker to maker, I speak in broad generalizations about each. Listing all problems found at any given time in one makers receivers, does not mean that every receiver has all those problems at once. Although, I have seen receivers with all problems at once. Those are the ones you really wish you would have sent back. But I struggled through completing the long duration builds, and still came out with really nice rifles that fire consistently accurate, and will no doubt last a lifetime.

The more I converse with Clint Jr., the more I like him. He seems genuinely dedicated to getting it right. If you use a bolt of their's, and a receiver, you have a better chance at minimal or no lapping, compared to other makers. The last rear lugged I did with their combo of parts, had contact on both sides. The left was maybe 10% contact and the right was 40%, so I elected to lap a little, as I had ample room for headspace before finish reaming. Geeck is arriving this Saturday so we can do a rear lug build from Fulton for his #2 competition rifle. With his permission, I will post how it goes, or ask him to do so. His #1 is a 762MM Firearms, and has held it's own in many competitions to date. He is now placing in the money in many places he goes to shoot with it. He partners up with Bamban in pair firings and the instances of his humility are becoming less and less with each outing.

The important thing about contact, is not how much you have, but the relationship of the receiver lugs to the bolt lugs, dimensionally speaking. In other words, how perpindicular and squared to each other's faces they are.
If you have a left lug face on the receiver that is cut in an odd, or off angle, to the bolt lug when in battery, it will require more % of contact and lapping. Lately, in this regard, Fulton has surpassed all others, in my opinion and from my experience with all makers. I did not include SEI, because I have not done one of their new ones yet, and only worked a few of their older ones. I only owned one of their old ones for a short time, and then Cheepertokeepher talked me out of it, he is a lucky dog and a great guy! I regretted selling it the moment it left here, but knew it went to a good home and guy.
Tnx for your posts, always enjoy your clean clear technical fact related input and discussions.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fogtripper View Post
Ho boy.
Out of all of the manufacturers that have been discussed in this thread, the one that I would never ever send money and/or parts to is 7.62. I've lived vicariously through the threads created by the unhappy customers.
seen those threads too, but early on there were a bunch of happy customers. They were on my list of choices back when I was looking, till the threads....

But as of late based on a couple other threads, seems changes were made at their shop for the better to solve the problems.. but only time will tell !
Seems between the early ones, and now with the changes , some where something went a stray.
Maybe the response mwhite49 got, was them trying to get business back on track and win new customers to prove themselves.
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  #69  
Old 09-26-2012, 12:10 PM
hammonje hammonje is offline
 
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Don't go with 7.62mm. I mean come on. They have more issues with poor quality and horrific service. I wouldn't send them a 25c.
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  #70  
Old 09-26-2012, 12:50 PM
nf1e nf1e is offline
 
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Many folks swear by 7.62s product. The builds seem to be working well for most. Others swear at them. I met Chris at Camp Perry a couple of years ago and he seems to be trying in a tough market. As hammonje said most have had a terrible time with customer service. Their receivers that I have seen appear better than most. Luck of the draw as with any producer. Recomendations for 7.62 come about #3 on the hit parade.
Semper Fi
Art

Last edited by nf1e; 09-26-2012 at 02:05 PM.
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