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  #1  
Old 07-11-2017, 02:02 PM
von_landstuhl von_landstuhl is offline
 
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Default Bolt closes tight on Greek ammo

I rebarreled an M1903A3 with a NOS barrel from 1944. As expected, the chamber was short, so I finished it with a reamer. The bolt closes easy on a go gauge, closes snug on commercial ammo, and closes tight on CMP surplus Greek HXP ammo. From searching the 'net, I see this is not uncommon.

I have no experience with bolt actions, so I was wondering if there was any harm or danger in shooting the Greek ammo.
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  #2  
Old 07-11-2017, 02:24 PM
Kansas Poster Kansas Poster is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by von_landstuhl View Post
I rebarreled an M1903A3 with a NOS barrel from 1944. As expected, the chamber was short, so I finished it with a reamer. The bolt closes easy on a go gauge, closes snug on commercial ammo, and closes tight on CMP surplus Greek HXP ammo. From searching the 'net, I see this is not uncommon.

I have no experience with bolt actions, so I was wondering if there was any harm or danger in shooting the Greek ammo.
My thoughts only. If your bolt closes all the way, shoot away. But you need to look first. Might be a problem if you want to extract an unfired round, like stuck or pulling the cart out and leaving the bullet it in the barrel.

Could you ream the chamber just a little more?

BTW, my first son was born up the hill at Landstuhl in 1971. I was there too for the event as I started it all.
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  #3  
Old 07-11-2017, 02:38 PM
Kestrel4k Kestrel4k is offline
 
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For the OP, I'm thinking that HXP 77 is the culprit perhaps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Poster View Post
[...] Could you ream the chamber just a little more?
Wouldn't alter the rifle for just that - tight chambers are kinda nice for the most part.

Last edited by Kestrel4k; 07-11-2017 at 02:40 PM.
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  #4  
Old 07-11-2017, 02:40 PM
canes7 canes7 is offline
 
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IIRC it wasn't a headspace issue it was an extractor groove issue. Before you break out your reamer again make sure of what the actual problem is.
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  #5  
Old 07-11-2017, 03:29 PM
ceresco ceresco is offline
 
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It is almost certainly a "cartridge headspace" issue. HXP 30-06 is notorious for dimensional inconsistency.....and generally oversize in a way you will never see with Lake City M2. A RCBS precision micrometer case gauge will quickly demonstrate case "base to shoulder" deviation up to 0.010 over the "go" gauge. You can expect problems at plus 0.003 and serious ones when you reach 0.006" CMP experienced problems at CP with the 1903 match when they issued HXP some years ago. Do not alter your rifle. You can sort through the HXP and weed out the oversize rounds or better still make a body sizing die and run all your HXP through it to reset the shoulder. Any old 30-06 FL sizing die; remove the guts, carefully cut the top off to just allow a loaded round through and you are now able to "adjust" loaded ammo. Good Shooting. .. Addendum: There is a problem with HXP and the standard Lee #2 shellholder. The extractor groove is cut too shallow on a small percentage of the cases. A dial caliper will demonstrate the problem. Generally causes no difficulty in the rifle, but annoying when reloading. I used to toss those cases. Now I set the drill press chuck so I can push a case in, hold a 60 degree file in the extractor groove for a few seconds = problems solved for good.

Last edited by ceresco; 07-11-2017 at 03:38 PM.
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  #6  
Old 07-11-2017, 04:20 PM
von_landstuhl von_landstuhl is offline
 
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ceresco, thanks for the detailed reply. When I bought the 1000 rounds of loose ammo, I took the time to sort it by headstamp and repackage it in separate ammo cans. As I recall, I have at least 3 lots that were 200+ rounds. I'll check the others and see if I have better results.
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  #7  
Old 07-11-2017, 05:13 PM
Jpm Jpm is offline
 
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I have an 03 that is similar, it chambers HXP and LC just fine but its difficult to extract the HXP after shooting.
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  #8  
Old 07-11-2017, 06:21 PM
von_landstuhl von_landstuhl is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestrel4k View Post
For the OP, I'm thinking that HXP 77 is the culprit perhaps?
You called it!

The one that was difficult to load was a 1977. I had four other 77-stamped rounds left over from a recent range trip and none of them would load either.

I broke out the ammo cans of 1978s and even they were hit or miss. For every two that would load, I had one that wouldn't.

Thanks, all, for the assistance. I now have 100 rounds set aside for zeroing and next week's Games Match. I've never shot an 03 before and I'm really looking forward to it.

Last edited by von_landstuhl; 07-11-2017 at 06:24 PM.
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  #9  
Old 07-11-2017, 06:52 PM
chuckindenver chuckindenver is offline
 
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so cut it until it closes on the live round.
as thats what your shooting in it,
i stopped using a go gauge years ago,
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  #10  
Old 07-11-2017, 07:32 PM
ceresco ceresco is offline
 
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It is a mistake to assume that the problems wth HXP are limited to specific lots or years. The problem was quality control over the entire period they made the ammo. Likewise, it is a mistake to assume that HXP is uniform. This suggests that using any randomly selected HXP round as a guide to cutting the chamber deeper is less than an idea solution. I kept a plastic bag of outsize HXP at one time. One undamaged round issued to me at a match was too large to chamber in any 30-06. While generously cut chambers on bolt rifles and most used M1s will accommodate most HXP, it is still an ammo problem and can be solved. I will use HXP right from the can with most of my rifles. For matches or in rifles with tight chambers, I will sort the ammo--at least enough rounds for rapid fire. Uniform the ammo with a body die to 0.000 or -0.002 HS dimension as commercial and Lake City do and all the problems go away. Finally; I, and most of the shooters I know don't use HXP for matches. Handloads with lighter bullets are much preferred. HXP brass is fine for reloading and lasts forever. Good Shooting. ..

Last edited by ceresco; 07-11-2017 at 07:39 PM.
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