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  #1  
Old 03-13-2015, 09:02 AM
ceresco ceresco is offline
 
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Default M4 for modern military questions. ..

Building some M4s for modern military and pride of ownership. SARCO kits with 1 in 7 " chome lined barrels. They are good quality, function 100% so far and I have some sub MOA groups with 53gr SMK/VarGet (using a big scope and my NM service rifle lower). Have been wondering best way to get the short sight radius and cheap carry handle sight to work for 1-200 yard shooting. I am thinking to make the aperture smaller. Is a better quality carry handle worth it or can the sight components be upgraded? Going to use a standard AR buttstock which I assume will be MM legal. Also wondering if sling tension is a problem with the barrel mounted sling swivel and the stubby barrel. Studied comments welcome. Good Shooting........
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  #2  
Old 03-13-2015, 10:18 AM
jsudduth jsudduth is offline
 
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Originally Posted by ceresco View Post
Building some M4s for modern military and pride of ownership. SARCO kits with 1 in 7 " chome lined barrels. They are good quality, function 100% so far and I have some sub MOA groups with 53gr SMK/VarGet (using a big scope and my NM service rifle lower). Have been wondering best way to get the short sight radius and cheap carry handle sight to work for 1-200 yard shooting. I am thinking to make the aperture smaller. Is a better quality carry handle worth it or can the sight components be upgraded? Going to use a standard AR buttstock which I assume will be MM legal. Also wondering if sling tension is a problem with the barrel mounted sling swivel and the stubby barrel. Studied comments welcome. Good Shooting........
I've been shooting this rifle I purchased recently. I plan to shoot it at the Eastern games in May. The front sight I found to be a little short. I had it raised so high the detent was barely holding it. So I swapped it for a .040 taller post.

The rear sight is nothing special but since I'm not moving it after setting 200 yard zero it's been solid enough. I do find that I need to have the sling (M1 web) set a little looser than I would with my wood stock rifles. On the wooden rifles my sling (Ron Brown leather) is pretty tight. So far I have been impressed with the WIndham Weaponry rifle. With all that said, or rather, typed... I expect you will find the carry handles adequate as long as you aren't twisting the knobs a lot.

I have tried smaller apertures on other rifles and find that my sight picture gets too dim and some "cobwebbing" interferes with the sight picture. I do believe that those drawbacks offset any potential accuracy gains so I went back to standard size apertures. This might be a try it for yourself type thing since everyone's eyesight is a bit different. I've heard of some shooters that fill in the aperture with something like JB Weld and drill a smaller hole instead of buying a new rear sight. Sounds like a cheap way to test out a smaller aperture before dropping any money on something that gets tossed into a drawer and forgotten.

Any buttstock should be legal as long as you make weight. Telescoping stocks will be taped in place if they aren't already fixed in place by the shooter prior to check in. Or at least that is my understanding.

Jim

Last edited by jsudduth; 03-13-2015 at 10:38 AM.
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  #3  
Old 03-13-2015, 02:30 PM
NEWGUY556 NEWGUY556 is offline
 
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Location: Avondale, AZ
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I have an m4 A2 and used It for MM last october.
Just watch your sling tension, keep it snug not really tight. Keep it consistent, I use Web slings, and take the slack out using the rear buckle and never touch the front one after I get it set the first time.
I doubt flip up sights are going to work well, better off with a detachable carry handle.
I have smaller apertures on both my 03a3 and Garand. I shot with the standard size on the M4 and it worked fine. I think the shorter sight radius is easier for me.
I did try my Rifle lower with my carbine upper, didn't really like it. It felt un natural and threw the balance off.
I shot ok with it, Offhand is really fun once you are used to a 13+ pound gun and you switch to a 5lb carbine, makes your wobble speed quadruple.
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Old 03-13-2015, 02:38 PM
canes7 canes7 is online now
 
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I built a rifle, very similar to Jim's using the WW 1/7 govt. profile barrel and have been happy with the results so far. To adjust sling tension I leave it one set of holes looser than I would my NM AR then cinch up my left hand a bit just until I get the slack taken up and the rifle just starts to lay down in my palm. I end up with a little higher of a position than normal but for 10 shots I can deal with it.
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  #5  
Old 03-21-2015, 06:21 PM
maxim maxim is offline
 
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I agree with light sling pressure. I found that if you sling it very tight you can effect impact.
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Old 03-22-2015, 09:08 AM
canes7 canes7 is online now
 
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I shot my first match with the 20" govt. profile barrel yesterday. Wow, I knew sling pressure would have an effect but not as much as I experienced. When I broke the rifle in I did it off the bench and offhand shooting 10's and x's no problem.

Add sling pressure, even what I consider light, and it started shooting 8's and 7's low and left. I switched slings to a web sling but never really did get it worked out with the limited ammo I brought. One thing I think may help is to move your left hand (righty shooter) as far forward as possible.

This may be a little tougher than I originally thought.
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  #7  
Old 03-22-2015, 08:57 PM
ceresco ceresco is offline
 
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I tried the A1with the pencil barrel years ago and determined that it was hopeless with a sling. Have been working with the M4 and it is coming along well. Shot a 99 and 97 in 100yd prones in a match. All points lost were me--not the rifle. This rifle will shoot sub moa, scoped, off a rest with 53gr match bullets. It does not seem to be sensitive to sling tension at all. I filled the rear aperture on the carry handle sight and re-drilled to about .040, also filed the front sight down as it was about three times the width of the SR black. At present, it has a $15 Chinese handle--first sighter in the match was an X and I never needed to touch the adjustments. Remaining problems are with the standard AR trigger and the difficulty of focusing on the front sight. Weight is less than 7 lbs. It will get a match trigger, maybe a better quality carry handle and some more work on the sights. Good thing the AR gets a separate class in MM, because it looks like this M4 will beat everything else. Good Shooting. .. ADDENDUM--Good thing I ddn't need a sight adjustment. Was testing the Chinese carry handle sight and it is appalling. Tried "boxing" the adjustments with 6 click increments. Completely failed the test. The Colt carry handle did better, but the box still looked more like a parallelogram. More study needed......

Last edited by ceresco; 03-24-2015 at 08:40 AM.
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  #8  
Old 03-22-2015, 09:45 PM
OKC_Jim OKC_Jim is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceresco View Post
It will get a match trigger...
Any idea what trigger you'll go with?
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  #9  
Old 03-22-2015, 09:51 PM
ceresco ceresco is offline
 
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It will be a Bushmaster.....but only because I have one sitting around that someone else didn't want. They work fine until they quit working...... Good Shooting. ...
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  #10  
Old 03-22-2015, 10:21 PM
stu929 stu929 is offline
 
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Location: Western Md
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For MM does it have to be a 16inch M4? Can you use an hbar? Reason i ask is in my wonderful state they have banned uppers with the grenade launcher cut so i would need an hbar or some other cut barrel.

Last edited by stu929; 03-22-2015 at 10:54 PM.
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