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  #11  
Old 12-22-2009, 06:05 AM
Jim X Jim X is offline
 
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The most inexpensive bullets you can get are the ones you pour yourself!!!!
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  #12  
Old 12-22-2009, 02:35 PM
fischfam fischfam is offline
 
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As mentioned earlier I just ordered some 110 gr Sierra SP and they will be here in a few days. Then I went to the IMR web page (I know, I did it backwards) and looked up the combination of bullet/powder/velocity and the result was 3,263 fps at the starting load of 55 grains with a 110 grain SP. This is too hot for the M1 Garand so do I now need to install an adjustable plug or is there another way to use up the 110 gr SP? Or do I just have to wait until the Greek HPX comes in .
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  #13  
Old 12-22-2009, 07:17 PM
DaveHH DaveHH is offline
 
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Default 30 years ago I decided that whatever the Service Teams were using

was what I would try. They at the time, used the Sierra 168gr International (today called Match King). They cost a few bucks more, but nothing including Hornady could come close. And believe me, I put in the time to test them. It had to do with the machines that made them, Sierra was using brand new state of the art machines and it showed. Today, I would bet that Nosler and Hornady both make equally good bullets. The stuff that comes out of Yugoslavia is just military grade bullets, GW is probably Taiwanese. Those brands just can't compete with the good brands. Even Frankfort Arsenal GI match bullets are not even close to the Sierras. If you want to realize the full potential of yourself and your rifle, buy the best bullet you can afford. It's like racing in the Daytona 500 with a Yugo, you are beat before you start the race.
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  #14  
Old 12-22-2009, 08:20 PM
rifle guy rifle guy is offline
 
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For reloads I've used mostly Sierra 150 HPBT from 100 to 300 yards with good success. Not cheap but good. Recently at 100 to 200 I've used GWB 150's for club matches and can clean a target slow prone with my A3 using them if I do my part, at about $0.11-$0.12 @ a good value at half the cost of Sierra's. Don't get me wrong Sierra's are about at good as it can get but at half the price I have no complaints with GWB's. I have a batch loaded for my M1 and will give them a go as soon as the weather here in Michigan permits. For 600 I've used Hornady 168 HPBT with good results concidering my ability, lots of "9's" and 10's. I recently came into a lot of Lapau 170 HPBT (rebated) and I have a batch ready to try out soon, also for my M1. Hopefully more "10's" than 9's.

rifle guy @ LSC
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  #15  
Old 12-22-2009, 11:31 PM
mousegun mousegun is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveHH View Post
was what I would try. They at the time, used the Sierra 168gr International (today called Match King). They cost a few bucks more, but nothing including Hornady could come close. And believe me, I put in the time to test them. It had to do with the machines that made them, Sierra was using brand new state of the art machines and it showed. Today, I would bet that Nosler and Hornady both make equally good bullets. The stuff that comes out of Yugoslavia is just military grade bullets, GW is probably Taiwanese. Those brands just can't compete with the good brands. Even Frankfort Arsenal GI match bullets are not even close to the Sierras. If you want to realize the full potential of yourself and your rifle, buy the best bullet you can afford. It's like racing in the Daytona 500 with a Yugo, you are beat before you start the race.
Golden West bullets are made in a small potatoes machine shop just up the road from here in South El Monte, CA.

My only experience is with .30 cal. 168 FMJBTs, but as far as quality is concerned, sometimes yer lucky, sometimes not. On the average they seem to be comparable to milspec ball. They can be measurably improved when sorted by weight. Also, they seem to have come from worn dies: some are round and some may be as much as .0004" out. Just squeeze 'em through a Lee .308 die using case lube. The good ones slip through and the oblong ones take a little more force.

Shoot 'em as is for plinking and 100 yd. target. Sorted and squoze they're as good or better than Remington 165gr. Corelokt.
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  #16  
Old 12-23-2009, 07:15 AM
ceresco ceresco is online now
 
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Fischam--You have me a bit concerned. The way to get around the problem with the IMR website load is to USE LESS POWDER. Lyman lists the starting load for 110gr HP and IMR4064 at 50.0grs--3030fps. That's like Baby Bears porridge--just right. If you need help before you start handloading, get it and get some handloading manuals and read them. Rifle Guy--the weather will permit shooting this saturday. We will expect nothing less than 10 GWs in the 10-x ring. PM me for directions--and bring Doggie and the Big Guy. Good Shooting.......

Last edited by ceresco; 12-23-2009 at 07:30 AM.
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  #17  
Old 12-23-2009, 07:47 AM
oldNJshooter oldNJshooter is offline
 
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My standard .30 cal match grade bullet for decades has been the Sierra 168 gr. HPBT bullet (#2200). I don't actually shoot high power matches but do insist on the best accuracy that I can achieve from my rifles as I believe most of us do.

I have shot thousands over the years thru good quality rifles both bolt and semi-auto with outstanding results when I do my part.

My M1A-NM shoots it's best with this bullet.

This being said, neither my SA/SG M1 or my HRA/SG is worthy of the price that these bullets bring today. They just do not shoot well enough, (3"- 4" with Greek ball), with the Sierra bullet to warrant the cost. There is no improvement in accuracy.

I had read about the Mil-Spec 168 gr. BTHP bullet being both good and bad avilable from Widener's in bulk.

http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.c...ir=278|281|727

I recently bought 500 of these bullets to try in my rifles. Weighing three batches of 10 bullets each, I found that they varied only slightly. Not as good as the Sierra bullet but more than acceptable.

Accuracy thru both of my M1's is as agood if not a tad better than ball. They do not shoot as well thru my M1A-NM as the Sierra but not bad enough not to use as a substitute at a savings.
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  #18  
Old 12-23-2009, 09:20 AM
fischfam fischfam is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceresco View Post
Fischam--You have me a bit concerned. The way to get around the problem with the IMR website load is to USE LESS POWDER. Lyman lists the starting load for 110gr HP and IMR4064 at 50.0grs--3030fps. That's like Baby Bears porridge--just right. If you need help before you start handloading, get it and get some handloading manuals and read them. Rifle Guy--the weather will permit shooting this saturday. We will expect nothing less than 10 GWs in the 10-x ring. PM me for directions--and bring Doggie and the Big Guy. Good Shooting.......
Ceresco,
I understand what you are saying since I have been reloading for my pistols for almost a year and but just started reloading for my .30-06. I do have enough manuals and literature currently but when I quoted the 'starting loads' from the manufactures website using IMR4064 shouldn't that be the starting point rather than where you go lower from? I don't want to create too weak a load. Either way isn't the 3030 fps too hot for my 1944 FG/SA M1 Garand? Any of the data I have seen so far does not fall into the 2750 fps safe range and I don't want to damage my op rod. Anyhow has anyone loaded or seen data for a 110gr SP using IMR4064 to a velocity of around 2750 fps?
Thanks,
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  #19  
Old 12-23-2009, 10:19 AM
Slapshot Slapshot is offline
 
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Location: Kalamazoo County, Michigan
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Fischfam, "reduced" loads are used all the time (that's the subject of many posts), although I don't consider 50 grs. of IMR 4064 to be a reduced load in the true sense of "reduced". Note that using the same Hodgdon website, the starting load for a 110 gr. bullet using VARGET is also 55 grs. Varget and 4064 have almost identical burn rates. I get outstanding results using 50.5 grs. of VARGET for my match loads. My chrono result for this load is an avg. of 2780 fps. You'll do just fine using 50 grs. of IMR 4064.
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  #20  
Old 12-23-2009, 03:33 PM
ceresco ceresco is online now
 
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I have not looked at a IMR website but their "Handloading guide" (no date) lists 58.0grs IMR 4064 (compressed load) 3320fps from a 23 inch barrel. They recommend starting 10% low and working up. I don't think I would ever use dare use that load and certainly not in an M1. There are other scary loads in that manual that got my attention years ago. Don't know what goes at IMR but they were (are??) not whimps there. I suggest the Lyman Handloading manuals (50.0--55.5grs IMR 4064 for 30-06 110gr bullet) are among the very best. It is always a good idea to check several manuals and possibly even to avoid IMR data. A velocity of 3000fps for a 110gr bullet is reasonable for a M1 although you are losing the diminished recoil at that level. Remember the faster bullet clears the gas port to muzzle distance quicker, reducng the gas impulse some. I prefer about 2900fps with the 110s. Good Shooting.......
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