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  #1  
Old 04-28-2020, 09:47 AM
petro petro is offline
 
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Default Is this a Boyd WW2 Sling?

Any help is appreciated!

https://imgur.com/gallery/mTtX9fj
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Old 04-28-2020, 09:54 AM
Twinson Twinson is offline
 
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Looks fishy. Why does the stamping look so off? Who knew..

Last edited by Twinson; 04-28-2020 at 07:01 PM.
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  #3  
Old 04-28-2020, 11:22 AM
Turner Saddlery, Inc. Turner Saddlery, Inc. is offline
 
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Boyt 43 (Boyt Harness Company)

From what I can see it looks legit. The rivets are blackened brass and correct. The stamp lettering is consistent with originals I have on hand and have seen in the past, as well as the unique "B" and "Y" which was consistent in the Boyt lettering. The hook (frog) is consistent with the hooks used at the time. The end where the hook is riveted has the proper cut and rounded corners consistent with Boyt in WWII. Would like to see a photo of the short strap sewn end (front and back), but from what I can see, the stitching is correct, linen thread of the correct color and it appears to have been stitched with a needle and awl harness stitcher as used in that era. From what I see in the photos, the sling doesn't appear to have seen much use and little to no oiling. The oblong holes are consistent with the shape and size punch tubes that Boyt used during WWII.

Richard
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Old 04-28-2020, 12:02 PM
petro petro is offline
 
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Default Short Sling pictures

here are the pictures requested:

https://imgur.com/gallery/hNqQoJo
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  #5  
Old 04-28-2020, 12:42 PM
Turner Saddlery, Inc. Turner Saddlery, Inc. is offline
 
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Petro:

The sling is correct, made by Boyt. The stitching on the short strap is consistent with Boyt and the specifications for beginning and ending the stitching with a back-stitch. The edge creasing is also correct, consistent with the creases I have seen on Boyt run slings. The creases are made with a creasing machine which creases both edges as the strap is ran through the machine.

The creases were made with a creasing machine like this Randall Harness Creaser, it was made in the late 1880s-1890s, and was surplused out of one of the arsenals, just don't know which arsenal. This creaser is configured differently than the creasers which Randall sold to the civilian market at the time.

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]

The strap is first ran through the appropriate width on right side of the machine which makes the crease, then the strap is moved over to the left side where the creaser rounds and slicks not only the creased edge, but rounds and slicks the rough edge on the back of the strap.

Richard
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  #6  
Old 04-29-2020, 05:13 PM
Turner Saddlery, Inc. Turner Saddlery, Inc. is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twinson View Post
Looks fishy. Why does the stamping look so off? Who knew..
I have seen several Boyt slings marked in this fashion over the past 30 years that I have been making slings and repairing vintage original slings. Boyt had more than one type stamp that they stamped slings, holsters, and scabbards with. There are at least 5 different variations of stamps used during the WWII period alone. Most common is the Boyt stamp which has the two digit year centered beneath Boyt, with the "B" and "T" being larger than the letters O and Y. About 15 years ago, I was fortunate to be able to talk to Mr. Bob Crosser, who began working at Boyt during WWII, he retired from Boyt in the early 1990s. Mr. Crosser verified that Boyt used various stamps for stamping their WWII goods, and the stamps varied in style and size. Several workers were tasked in inspecting and stamping various products prior to shipping to the various arsenals and supply points. Several dies had the two digit year incorporated in the Boyt die as a single stamp. Others were a stamp that read Boyt and the year date was applied with a separate stamp. When I asked about the placement of the stamp, he said that they were in wartime production and each item had a general location where the name date stamp should be placed. Some items produced did not have a date, just "Boyt".

Boyt slings marked in this fashion, as pictured by the OP, are out there and I have had a few come through the shop for repair. In this case, two stamps were used to apply the name and date. Here are photos of two Boyt slings which are marked in a similar fashion. These slings came up while doing a random internet search of the same style marking.

Sling #1
[IMG][/IMG]

Sling #2
[IMG][/IMG]

Richard
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Old 04-29-2020, 09:17 PM
Whitpusmc Whitpusmc is offline
 
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What is the purpose of the crease? Cosmetic or is it an attempt to stiffen like a soup cans indents?

Whit
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Old 04-29-2020, 10:04 PM
Turner Saddlery, Inc. Turner Saddlery, Inc. is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitpusmc View Post
What is the purpose of the crease? Cosmetic or is it an attempt to stiffen like a soup cans indents?

Whit
Whit: Semper Fi, from an Old Gunny

Creasing the edge, rolls the cut corner of the epidermis (hair/grain side) of the leather. It not only makes the edge of the leather more durable and tough, but keeps the edge from sloughing (fuzzing) up as bad through use. MILSPECS of the era required all leather straps for military goods to be edged and creased. Edging was the removal of the corner edge on the flesh side of the leather. With strap goods, a creasing machine such as the one pictured above, accomplished the edging requirement by pressure (compression) rolling the flesh edge at the same time as the crease was being applied through the creasing process. If you notice, the rolls on the creasing machine have polished radiused edges which form a 45 degree radiused edge on the strap.

In equipment made of harness leather, MILSPEC requires harness leather to be creased with a hot iron creaser, which is done by hand with a creasing iron, just warm enough not to burn the leather. This brings the waxes in the harness leather edge to the surface, therefore sealing the edge.

I have U.S. Ordnance Department Saddler's Manuals going back to 1859 that require creasing where practicable, but I've seen both British and U.S. Military leather goods creased as far back as the War of 1812.

Richard

Last edited by Turner Saddlery, Inc.; 04-29-2020 at 10:08 PM.
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Old 05-08-2020, 09:24 AM
bkleinhenz bkleinhenz is offline
 
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I enjoyed that discussion and photo illustration.
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