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  #11  
Old 02-15-2019, 08:29 PM
jmm jmm is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikld View Post
Lots of reloaders have gotten away with using large primers in small primer applications for quite a while.
That sounds like a lot of work.
I can see converting berdan primed cases to use boxer primers, but when I look at the casehead diameter of small primer cases, I think the large primer cavity will be a challenge.
But, hey, I'm no expert.
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  #12  
Old 02-15-2019, 09:33 PM
colt100 colt100 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gewehr43 View Post
This.... I'm curious about the rifle problem you are having which caused this.



Also why did you buy 10,000 primers that you hadn't really checked to make sure they worked for you?



But to your question:

I use pistol primers for pistol loads and rifle for rifle...

I don't own a SMG and so don't see the need to jump around at all....
Rifles work fine with other reloads using other primers and factory ammo. I have ruled it down to the primers.

I bought a k or 2 to try. Had no problems with those. Saw a good deal from a retailer years ago and picked up about 20k. When i started going through the 20k i bought, i started having the slight hang fire on some rounds. Not all. I can feel a click then about a tenth of a second later, bang.

They are primers manufactured overseas. Before i started having problems i tossed the reciept. Never had these issues before with any primers so didn't think i needed it. Of course, when i started to realize i was having problems, i couldn't remember specifically which vender i bought them from as i order from several due to whoever has deals. Doubt the overseas manufacturer would do anything except tell me to return to vender. Live and learn i guess.

I dont just want to can these, as they work just fine in my 6.8 loads, and i have well over 10k of them left. It seems that 3006 and 308 experience the hangfires. When loaded in the 6.8, ive never had a hangfire. Leads me to believe that for some reason, the extra powder in the 308 (over 40 gr versus about 28 for the 6.8) is harder to light for some reason. Never experienced this before in my almost 20 years of reloading.

Just fyi, my 3006 loads are used in my 7 garands, all i have tried experience the problem with these primers. All cmp guns including a special. My 308 is an m1a. Also not experienced with any other primers.



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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikld View Post
With any mass produced product, manufacturing tolerances are used. If a primer is at the top end of the height tolerance gets shoved in a pocket that's on the short end of the depth tolerance there is a possibility of a high primer, .003". And since most reloaders want a primer to be at least .002" below flush, we have a situation where the seated primer is .005" too tall. Maybe this is just nitpicking, but for my guns and ammo, I will use the correct components per the cartridge. (in the '70s and '80s I experimented with primers; rifle in pistol, pistol in rifle, standard instead of magnum, magnum in standard applications, but mostly in revolvers and bolt guns and found the "industry standard recommended" primers work quite well). It's really not that big a deal, so it's your guns, your ammo, your choice...



Lots of reloaders have gotten away with using large primers in small primer applications for quite a while. I had a friend that liked to ride his motorcycle w/o a helmet and fast. He got away with it for many years, but ONE time he didn't. He died when his head made contact with a curb at 45 MPH...
I guess this is my question. If the lr seats flush, is there any danger of using them? I tried to seat a couple in the 45 brass and they appear flush. The cases appear level when set on a table, no wobble.

Hypothetically if the primers are .001 over, is there an issue? What about .002? At what point am i riding without a helmet? Of couse, motorcyclists do die when wearing helmets so i really looking for any real data about the real risks, if any, of doing this.

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Last edited by Big_Red; 02-17-2019 at 03:06 AM. Reason: Merge consecutive posts
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  #13  
Old 02-15-2019, 10:38 PM
Gewehr43 Gewehr43 is offline
 
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So these are Russian?
I mean no harm in naming them.....
So which ones are they?

Just curious, are the loads that are hang firing a ball powder load?

I understand your situation entirely, just thinking out loud...…
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  #14  
Old 02-16-2019, 05:45 AM
colt100 colt100 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gewehr43 View Post
So these are Russian?
I mean no harm in naming them.....
So which ones are they?

Just curious, are the loads that are hang firing a ball powder load?

I understand your situation entirely, just thinking out loud...
Not Russian. I shot alot of wolf primers until they dried up. They worked great.

Im hesitant to name them. Not looking to bash any companies. They are from a brand name overseas company.

The loads that are hang firing are ball powder, and extruded. Mainly ball in the 308, extruded in the garand, 3006 loads.

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  #15  
Old 02-16-2019, 07:16 AM
Rich/WIS Rich/WIS is offline
 
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I had a similar issue with ball powders (BLC2 and Win 748) in 06 and 243. Switched to magnum primers and the problem went away.
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  #16  
Old 02-16-2019, 02:01 PM
nyukx3fan nyukx3fan is offline
 
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I had a similar question.....I had too many large pistol primers and wanted to use them for rifle. What I discovered:

Small rifle and pistol primers are identical in size.

Large Pistol and Large Rifle only vary by wight. One is 5.3 grains and one is 4.7 grains. One is taller by .010 at the most. Most cups I found varied by .003.

I contacted CCI and they said that the rifle primer has a hotter mix than the pistol primer. I cant find the email response but the guy said a softer ignition using a pistol primer may cause a delayed ignition hence causing a detonation. Which I thought was crap because you can't speed up the burn rate of the power. Burn rate doesn't change. The only thing I could think of he was saying the bullet leaps forward from the initial primer detonation........powder goes forward unburnt , bullet stops.......then the powder ignites. Wish I could find the email.

That wont be the case if you use rifle primers in pistol.
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  #17  
Old 02-16-2019, 09:52 PM
colt100 colt100 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich/WIS View Post
I had a similar issue with ball powders (BLC2 and Win 748) in 06 and 243. Switched to magnum primers and the problem went away.
These are supposed to be mag primers...

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  #18  
Old 02-17-2019, 12:52 PM
lapriester lapriester is offline
 
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Jeese, just use the correct primers for the correct ammo. Dispose of the ones you no longer use. Screwing around mixing primer use is a fools errand that has no legitimate reward. Like wearing a pink sock and a brown one of the same size because you're too cheap to go out and buy matching socks.
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  #19  
Old 02-18-2019, 01:41 AM
colt100 colt100 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lapriester View Post
Jeese, just use the correct primers for the correct ammo. Dispose of the ones you no longer use. Screwing around mixing primer use is a fools errand that has no legitimate reward. Like wearing a pink sock and a brown one of the same size because you're too cheap to go out and buy matching socks.
With due respect, i am asking about why this is a fools errand. I seem to be getting a lot of answers to just use this cause that what the book said. Im trying to understand the "why" of these answers, especially when it seems to be commonly accepted that sr can be substituted for sp.

So far, ive understood that the primers might be too high, increasing a slam fire risk. I asked about primer dimensions based on what i measured, and from what was posted, the lr was in the lp spec. Unless i missed it, that didn't get answered. It would seem if i have a lr and lp primer that both measure .123, that no high primer issue would be present. I primed a few cases with lr and the primers appear flush.

I don't really wish to throw 100s of dollars of primers in the trash if there is a use for them. That would be a legitimate reward.

Besides "the book says not to" what are the reasons NOT to use lr in place of lp? Is there any danger? If so, can anyone explain it?

Not looking to do anything unsafe but others have posted they have used lr in lp cases with no effects.

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  #20  
Old 02-18-2019, 07:59 AM
CDRT CDRT is offline
 
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Since it appears we have not given you adequate answers, as to why NOT to do it, how about you call or email a company like Winchester or Federal, that produce primers and ask them the question. Maybe their responses might convince you not to do it.
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