Go Back   CMP Forums > CMP Competitions > Garand, Springfield, Military Rifle and Rimfire Matches
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-20-2018, 08:26 AM
Quarterbore Quarterbore is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Valley Forge, PA
Posts: 277
Default Gear for John Garand Matches suggestion

I’ve read the stickies but I am new to shooting the M1, or have not owned an M1 before so starting fresh.

En Bloc Clips

- I hope I didn’t mess up but I ordered 20 AEC-3 8rd clips, as well as one 2rd and one of the SLED clips from Ammo Garand. I dont know how easy it is to loose your en bloc at a match so my plan is to powder coat a few of the 8s, the 2 and SLED to Red to help me identify mine and make them easier to see/find.

I know with practice you can load 2rds in a standard en bloc but until then this is like training wheels.

Is is a bad idea to try to powder coat the clips, how often do you loose clips at matches or am I over thinking it?

Sling:

I used to shoot DCM/CMP with an AR so I have a turner sling on my mouse gun. I have also used both web sling and lighter leather slings on my 10/22s at Appleseed and NRA Rimfire Matches more recently (even that’s been close to 10 years now). I do prefer a leather sling if given the choice.

So, are leather slings allowed at John Garand Matches (as issued class)? If so, are there special rules on allowed leather slings? Next, what length sling works best with the garand (I am moderately tall at 6’2”)

Ammo

I bit the bullet and bought 400rds of Sellier & Bellot M2 Ball to get me started. My M1 order for a Service Grade just went in last week so I won’t have the gun until say May - July if the time projections are accurate so I may try to get another 400 rounds by then but I assume 400rds will let me shoot this season.

I expect I need to develop skill with the M1, but I assume this ammo should be good to go.

Targets and Cource of Fire?

The Club I want to shoot John Garand matches only has a 100-yard range (I think). I know that the SR-1 is the reduced target for 100yards but what would be correct targets for prone, sitting, standing?

Other gear:

I have a USMC shooting coat but I’ve gained weight since I last wore it so I am going to buy a canvas coat and wear a sweatshirt under it. I also have a shooting mat and spotting scopes. I need to buy a tall stand if I want to get serious about this too and Ill likely order with my coat. I also don’t have a fancy cart like some but I have a folding dolly that holds everything well enough. Then I have the small stuff like chamber flag, safety glasses and ear muffs.

Natural Point of aim and dry firing

I do plan to work with the M1 getting into position in home and establishing natural point of aim, practice breathing and dry firing. I assume that a snap cap is a good idea with the garand. Any feedback?

Rankings:

Are Garand matches scored and shooters ranked like NRA Highpower matches? For example Sharpshooter, Marksman, Expert, Master?

Anything Else?

What have I missed and thanks for your advice.

Last edited by Quarterbore; 03-20-2018 at 08:30 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-20-2018, 08:54 AM
canes7 canes7 is online now
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 2,276
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quarterbore View Post
Iíve read the stickies but I am new to shooting the M1, or have not owned an M1 before so starting fresh.

En Bloc Clips

- I hope I didnít mess up but I ordered 20 AEC-3 8rd clips, as well as one 2rd and one of the SLED clips from Ammo Garand. I dont know how easy it is to loose your en bloc at a match so my plan is to powder coat a few of the 8s, the 2 and SLED to Red to help me identify mine and make them easier to see/find.

You may run into more problems with the 2 rounders than it's worth. Make some dummy cartridges and practice.

Sling:

I used to shoot DCM/CMP with an AR so I have a turner sling on my mouse gun. I have also used both web sling and lighter leather slings on my 10/22s at Appleseed and NRA Rimfire Matches more recently (even thatís been close to 10 years now). I do prefer a leather sling if given the choice.

You'll be fine with the Turner sling.


Ammo

I bit the bullet and bought 400rds of Sellier & Bellot M2 Ball to get me started. My M1 order for a Service Grade just went in last week so I wonít have the gun until say May - July if the time projections are accurate so I may try to get another 400 rounds by then but I assume 400rds will let me shoot this season.

I expect I need to develop skill with the M1, but I assume this ammo should be good to go.

Targets and Cource of Fire?

The Club I want to shoot John Garand matches only has a 100-yard range (I think). I know that the SR-1 is the reduced target for 100yards but what would be correct targets for prone, sitting, standing?

Same target for all stages. SR-1 is good at 100 yards.


Other gear:

I have a USMC shooting coat but Iíve gained weight since I last wore it so I am going to buy a canvas coat and wear a sweatshirt under it. I also have a shooting mat and spotting scopes. I need to buy a tall stand if I want to get serious about this too and Ill likely order with my coat. I also donít have a fancy cart like some but I have a folding dolly that holds everything well enough. Then I have the small stuff like chamber flag, safety glasses and ear muffs.

Natural Point of aim and dry firing

I do plan to work with the M1 getting into position in home and establishing natural point of aim, practice breathing and dry firing. I assume that a snap cap is a good idea with the garand. Any feedback?

No need for a snap cap - there have literally been millions of dry-fires done with the M1 without causing a broken firing pin.

Rankings:

Are Garand matches scored and shooters ranked like NRA Highpower matches? For example Sharpshooter, Marksman, Expert, Master?

Nope - It's a neat idea and I wish the CMP would expand on a Games ranking system but I think they are afraid of causing too much competition. There is a overall rankings in the Competition Tracker I think.

Anything Else?

What have I missed and thanks for your advice.
Just have fun and don't let the drama sink in.
__________________
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan W.
CMP GSM Master Instructor
NRA - XTC HP Expert
16 down / 14 to go!
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-20-2018, 09:01 AM
Quarterbore Quarterbore is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Valley Forge, PA
Posts: 277
Default

Thanks, and you answered but I did consider spare parts (not sure which) to use for dry fire but practice with what you will shoot is my preference!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-20-2018, 09:12 AM
Kilo-Sierra Kilo-Sierra is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 416
Default

I have shot a lot of GSM matches Local, Regional, and Nationals. I mainly shoot HP now. Looks like you have already shot matches so pretty much know the drill already, you just need to knock the dust off your gear and show up. I addressed some of your questions below. If you have a specific question maybe I can help.

Keith Schachle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quarterbore View Post
I’ve read the stickies but I am new to shooting the M1, or have not owned an M1 before so starting fresh.

En Bloc Clips

- I hope I didn’t mess up but I ordered 20 AEC-3 8rd clips, as well as one 2rd and one of the SLED clips from Ammo Garand. I dont know how easy it is to loose your en bloc at a match so my plan is to powder coat a few of the 8s, the 2 and SLED to Red to help me identify mine and make them easier to see/find. 2rd clips are nice. Now I just use an 8rd regular enblock and load 2rds in it. If you do use the SLED for sing loading in offhand ....DON'T BE THAT GUY and forget to take it out. You will hold up the line and look dumb. Been there, done that, it's embarassing.

I know with practice you can load 2rds in a standard en bloc but until then this is like training wheels.

Is is a bad idea to try to powder coat the clips, how often do you loose clips at matches or am I over thinking it? I have NEVER lost an enbloc so don't think it's necessary to PC them. I do use a silver sharpie to ID mine with a number. I have 5-6 of them that are well worn looking because they ALWAYS functioned 100%.

Sling:

I used to shoot DCM/CMP with an AR so I have a turner sling on my mouse gun. I have also used both web sling and lighter leather slings on my 10/22s at Appleseed and NRA Rimfire Matches more recently (even that’s been close to 10 years now). I do prefer a leather sling if given the choice.

So, are leather slings allowed at John Garand Matches (as issued class)? If so, are there special rules on allowed leather slings? Next, what length sling works best with the garand (I am moderately tall at 6’2”) Leather slings are legal, cuff slings are not. I use Ron Brown slings on my GSM guns and SR's. Use what you feel works for you. I do NOT like the web slings, some guys love them and shoot great with the. I only buy 54" slings. They work well for both wood guns and SR's.

Ammo

I bit the bullet and bought 400rds of Sellier & Bellot M2 Ball to get me started. My M1 order for a Service Grade just went in last week so I won’t have the gun until say May - July if the time projections are accurate so I may try to get another 400 rounds by then but I assume 400rds will let me shoot this season.

I expect I need to develop skill with the M1, but I assume this ammo should be good to go. Not familiar with that ammo. I load 125gr TNT's for my wood guns. Main thing is to make sure the ammo is "garand friendly" and not hard on your op rod.

Targets and Course of Fire? 5 sighters prone then 10rds for score. Rapid prone . load 2 then 8. 10rds offhand. Very simple COF. No sitting for the 30rd matches.

The Club I want to shoot John Garand matches only has a 100-yard range (I think). I know that the SR-1 is the reduced target for 100yards but what would be correct targets for prone, sitting, standing? You shoot all shots at the same size/type target.

Other gear:

I have a USMC shooting coat but I’ve gained weight since I last wore it so I am going to buy a canvas coat and wear a sweatshirt under it. I also have a shooting mat and spotting scopes. I need to buy a tall stand if I want to get serious about this too and Ill likely order with my coat. I also don’t have a fancy cart like some but I have a folding dolly that holds everything well enough. Then I have the small stuff like chamber flag, safety glasses and ear muffs.

Natural Point of aim and dry firing

I do plan to work with the M1 getting into position in home and establishing natural point of aim, practice breathing and dry firing. I assume that a snap cap is a good idea with the garand. Any feedback? I've never used snap caps in my wood guns. Pretty sure some folks do, I don't.

Rankings:

Are Garand matches scored and shooters ranked like NRA Highpower matches? For example Sharpshooter, Marksman, Expert, Master? I earned my DR badge #2287, am a High Master in NRA XTC matches and High master in NRA Midrange. I missed HM in the new CMP ranking by 1/2 a point. CMP uses the cut scores for games. If you look at the Eastern Games program it pretty much explains this.

Anything Else? HYDRATE!!!! A small rag or wash cloth isn't a bad idea to keep with you for sweat. I dry fire almost EVERY day. Not only does it help marksmanship but makes my body stretch so i don't cramp up or am sore after matches. Dryfire in all of your positions to get your body used to it. Sitting used to kill my lower back. Now I actually like sitting and usually clean the 200yd target in HP.

What have I missed and thanks for your advice.
You're already ahead of the game by previous experience and asking questions. I'd suggest listening to all opinions, filter out the BS and use it. There are some REALLY helpful/knowledgeable shooters on this forum that are willing to advise you.
__________________
I can shoot a one hole/one shot group at any distance....."If I do my part"

Keith Schachle

Distinguished Rifleman Badge #2287
NRA XTC Service Rifle- High Master
NRA Midrange - High Master
CMP XTC Service Rifle - Master
CMP Master Instructor
Almost Perfect Attendance in the 3rd grade

Last edited by Kilo-Sierra; 03-20-2018 at 09:15 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-20-2018, 09:14 AM
Kilo-Sierra Kilo-Sierra is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 416
Default

Dang, Dan beat me to it!

Keith
__________________
I can shoot a one hole/one shot group at any distance....."If I do my part"

Keith Schachle

Distinguished Rifleman Badge #2287
NRA XTC Service Rifle- High Master
NRA Midrange - High Master
CMP XTC Service Rifle - Master
CMP Master Instructor
Almost Perfect Attendance in the 3rd grade
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-20-2018, 01:40 PM
Polaris Polaris is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Central Minnesota
Posts: 784
Default

Second above opinion on your clips. I do like the 2 rd clips. I would mark them with a sharpie or white out. Sometimes folks on the line can get grabby with clips and brass, especially with a larger field if you go rapidly from rapid fire to the pits and there is a short time to police brass and gear. A clear marking of your clips will keep them honest.

I prefer to use a set of compact 8x field binoculars in offhand only as needed. I tend to use them slow prone also at 200 yards if I trust my zero and calls. Sitting and Prone I glass with the scope on a tripod that came with the scope. I'm weird and cheap though, and the price of those fancy tall rods just turns me off when I don't feel the need for them at 200 yards and don't mind laying in the grass to spot and score a string.

Have heard good things about that S&B M2 ammo. Check out the ammunition section, I believe there's a thread or 2 on it.

Last edited by Polaris; 03-20-2018 at 01:42 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-20-2018, 05:59 PM
Belltower0351 Belltower0351 is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 409
Default

All the responses so far are spot on. Don't stress and have fun.

The only shooters I know that think a SLED is worth the hassle are left handers.

The S&B ammo is excellent. I have cleaned the SR target with it, including slow fire at Perry last year. You'll quickly find that you have a ton of fun and the 400 rounds will be gone before know it.
__________________
22 points down/ 8 to go
P100 2017
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-21-2018, 05:09 AM
Digital_Chaos Digital_Chaos is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Pickerington Ohio
Posts: 266
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belltower0351 View Post
All the responses so far are spot on. Don't stress and have fun.

The only shooters I know that think a SLED is worth the hassle are left handers.

The S&B ammo is excellent. I have cleaned the SR target with it, including slow fire at Perry last year. You'll quickly find that you have a ton of fun and the 400 rounds will be gone before know it.
Absolutely I'm a lefty and I love the 1 round sled..

to add I have no issues with the 2 round clips as well, I prefer them over crossing over the rounds

and another +1 on the SB ammo.. good stuff for the money..

Last edited by Digital_Chaos; 03-21-2018 at 05:12 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-21-2018, 10:05 AM
Polaris Polaris is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Central Minnesota
Posts: 784
Default

Forgot to mention, I assume you don't reload. Save your brass. You'll be able to sell or trade it towards your next ammo purchase.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-21-2018, 10:56 AM
Quarterbore Quarterbore is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Valley Forge, PA
Posts: 277
Default

I do reload, I just need to buy dies and brass.

Right now this place has been a poor influence and while I came to get an M1 Garand to do AS ISSUED CLASS I now started looking at 1903A3s and have a couple drill rifles on the way to hopefully do one 1903A3 rebuild and a second as a 1903A4 clone.

If I stop spending, Ill work on getting the brass but I canít test without a gun so kinda catch 22 for now! I may get the 1903A3 done first.

As for the sling, I will probably order a 54-inch Turner NM Sling that matches my AR Match rifle along with a Vintage M1 Sling. It will give me options. There is a gun show near home this weekend and I hope to see what I can find.

You guys have been a huge help, thank you!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:13 AM.