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  #11  
Old 06-25-2018, 09:15 PM
ZvenoMan ZvenoMan is offline
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceresco View Post
The OP asks a technical question and the answer is to tell him he needs to learn how to shoot?? Good Shooting. ..
No, I didn't say that.
But I did suggest mentioning how the rifle shoots now? And perhaps how that compares to other rifles he shoots?
Why fix a problem that doesn't exist? How do you tighten an M1A that holds 1 MOA?
Post 2 mentions a nice list with the stock towards the end. Coincidence? Most to least effective? Least to most expensive?

He asked for opinions, mine is to diagnose the problem before fixing anything.
FYI, not that you asked but your solution, if he has the SAI plastic stock is probably pretty good advice.

Lighten up?

JH
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  #12  
Old 06-25-2018, 09:22 PM
rickgman rickgman is online now
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Brown View Post
The best stock for serious, consistent accuracy has always been the glass bedded McMillan.
Ted, I agree. However, the operative word is "serious". They are mainly for serious competitors and they go for serious cash. For most shooters who want a good shooter, a McMillan is overkill. Just my two cent worth.
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  #13  
Old 06-25-2018, 09:23 PM
ZvenoMan ZvenoMan is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cedbwo View Post
No harm, no foul. It's been a while since I've been able to regularly hit the range, so practice and technique is high up there, I understand. In the meantime, I'd like to maximize potential of the rifle, which, from what I understand is best accomplished by starting with the stock. I'm a newbie to the M14, so advice is appreciated.
How is it shooting now?
Post 2 has a nice list, and my suggestion would be to get a baseline then test one improvement at a time.
Here's one of my tests.
Group on the left was shot with the rifle as-is. Then I made a change and shot another group, it is on the right. If it was worse I'd revert and try something else.



This forum is full of threads where the OP fixed a problem invented by a salesman, often many problems and realized they were in good shape to begin with.
JH
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  #14  
Old 06-26-2018, 12:08 PM
Ted Brown Ted Brown is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jacksonville, OR
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Um... Yes.
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  #15  
Old 06-27-2018, 10:16 AM
M14 M14 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: south mississippi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cedbwo View Post
Hello all,
I'm new to the M14/M1A world, and am looking for the best way to boost accuracy without adding weight.

Best way to not add weight, is to subtract weight. This narrows the options to retaining the stock you have, find a lighter one, or use a g.i. fiberglass stock for the lightest possible solution. It will have to be stiffened in the fore end with fiberglass and/or carbine fiber or arrow shafts, and bedded for maximum accuracy.

In my accuracy test against all stocks mentioned, done properly, these will outperform most stocks while meeting weight requirements. Be advised, a lighter rifle means more felt recoil.

If money is not a problem, then a McMillan is in order, but you have then added weight.


So, my basic question is: What stock would be the best to use in order to maximize accuracy?

The best stock to use is the one that has been fitted to the action properly to achieve no movement during firing.

Or, what would be the best modification to a plain jane USGI birch stock to boost the accuracy?

The best modification will be bedding the action to the stock and creating proper draw pressure while doing it.



From the research I've done, I've found a few options:

-Synthetic stock such as archangel M14 stock

Only if it fits perfectly, which none do because it is dependent on receivers being within specifications. Even then, proper fitting and/or bedding needs to be addressed for a foolproof fix. One stock manufacturer plus a half dozen different receiver manufacturers, does not equal drop-in accuracy. A few will have good results from luck of the draw, but not the norm.
-SAGE chassis

Highly dependent on the same parameters as the above example. Also, the barrel tensioner screw can be finicky and POI may change with varied ammunition. Another example, if the receiver legs are not exactly, let's say .832" - .835" and SAGE makes all their chassis the same, then you get a receiver with skewed leg specs...well, you see the problem. It won't fit tight to stop all movement of the action in the stock and you are back to square one.

Although, this past Saturday I took my pre-ban SAI with all g.i. SA parts, including the chrome lined g.i. barrel out in my SAGE NSG chassis and shot one 3 shot group of 4.5" at 1000yds. The trip was originally for testing my new Vortex Viper scope and new ammo load, but it also speaks volumes for a properly fitted SAGE. Yeah, the stars aligned and I have found my load.


-Bedding a USGI stock. If done, is it like a garand where you should not remove the stock once it's bedded?

I've posted this numerous times on the web, but for the benefit of the newer folks,..... this is an old wives tale. The receiver legs have an angle milled on them to facilitate removal from the stock for this perceived issue of wrecking the bedding, and to make assembly and disassembly possible in the original stock liners. All one need do to stop bedding damage is to first have someone that knows what they are doing when bedding a rifle, and use care when taking it apart to clean.

Simply remove the gas plug, loosen the gas lock, and slide the gas cylinder forward until the barrel band clears the stock ferrule, then the action can be removed straight up and out of the stock without any damage at all to the bedding, providing that the armorer that did the original bedding used the right mixture of materials, prep work (degreasing), and hardness.

Some of the ones I have done are over 9 years old and are shot in matches almost every weekend. None of them has ever been returned for skim bedding or tightening up because I instructed the owners how to care for them, as above. I've actually replaced several Krieger barrels in these builds, with the same type barrels, and was able to get the same results in accuracy without changing the bedding or draw pressure. Slight point of impact change was adjusted.

Any recommendations are appreciated. Looking to maximize the potential of this sweet rifle.

THanks.
Good luck in your quest and let us know how it turns out.
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  #16  
Old 06-30-2018, 05:49 PM
KurtC KurtC is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 130
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The M14 shoots differently than a bolt action or an AR. The instant you start pulling the trigger, everything vibrates. If using a standard stock, you need to sling up tight, consistently. Watch the video below.

The easiest way to tighten the groups of a Standard M1A/M14 rifle is to properly install it into a SAGE or JAE stock. Both have barrel tensioners that will reduce unnecessary vibration.

A properly bedded medium weight walnut stock, or a heavy wood or fiberglass stock works in conjunction with other mods, such as unitized gas cylinder.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhrQciStUNs
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  #17  
Old 07-01-2018, 06:52 AM
Glashaus Glashaus is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 18
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It is amazing how much better my M1A Standard shoots in a Sage!
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