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  #11  
Old 08-17-2018, 07:05 PM
Smal Smal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renisin View Post
They're all good receivers, you decide what you can afford. The information is out there just do your home work.

SEI, GWLA are no longer producing receivers, these will be more difficult to get and costly.

Your best bet right now would be LRB, Bula, Fulton receivers.

Ren
Now that's the kind of advice and info I'm looking for,I'm not an expert on M14 rifles though I have built a couple on Fulton receivers but am interested in the Hammer forged ones now to upgrade as I have come into a very nice condition Winchester kit,Thank you very much for that i have done some homework but seems to be a bunch of bickering going on I was not really interested in reading about who is better and who did what to whom etc,so it was kind of hard to figure out what would be my best choice with so much bad blood flowing about this company and that one etc,I think it hurts them all in sales, in the long run, to act like that,But I appreciate your guidance,Thank You

Quote:
Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
Norinco, Mauntz and Federal ord can be added to your initial list. There are a few others but the names escape me at the moment.
There are only two currently produced receivers available to the general public one would be a Fulton cast and the other Bula Defense Systems which is forged. Ted Brown has some GWLA receivers that were the last of their production for sale . Just got one myself so I would have it for the herd.
Any of the rest you mentioned can be found if you are patient and or have deep pockets.
I have built on most of your list over the last 50+ years and, for what can be had today, Bula would be the most cost effective in my opinion. I have over 2 dozen of there products in my collection along with another 2 dozen of other manufactures that I have added over the years.
All currently made receivers are as close to USGI spec as is allowed but any can vary within a batch slightly.
. Thank you so much now that’s the constructive kind of information I was looking for I had thought about GWLA receivers but not having a warranty to fall back on sure makes me nervous when I am spending that kind of money but they sure are beautiful receivers Bula I have never purchased any of there products and lately I heard some squabbling over there bolts and furring pin issues and never having bought any of there products and there kind of the new kid on the block M14 receiver wise I have just been waiting and watching on how happy people are with there products so far there receivers seem to be good to go as you must know you have many and Smith enterprises I had no idea was out of the Bussiness I have been doing homework but also observing too as I’ve never bought a Hammer forged M14 receiver and that’s what I’m leaning to as I have built two Fulton receivers up but I’d like to build one with a dummy kit on it and putting one on a Fulton receiver seems to be very difficult with that thick rail thank you so much for the info it’s helped me decide s few issues I was tossing around for sure
. Cost effective was exactly one of the major questions I was contemplating also thank you very much for addressing that not knowing a whole lot about bulls products and hearing a little negativity about them recently had me concerned but I’ll mark that up to growing pains all company’s go thru when new or have new products but you addressed two major issues I had concerns about so thank you very much Jim

Last edited by Big_Red; 08-18-2018 at 03:17 AM. Reason: Shotgun posting again
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  #12  
Old 08-17-2018, 08:09 PM
M14 M14 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smal View Post
Ok With Bula now having their receivers, Smith Enterprises, LRB,7.62mm, Fulton, JRA, Gun Works of Lower Alabama, Polytec, Springfield Armory Genesco Ill, ok now who did I forget any other makers?

Now out of all of these who makes the best receiver for the money, Not who makes the absolute best receiver or worst one but Dollar for the Dollar price wise who gives you the best working receiver for the dollar if I wanted to get a good reliable long lasting quality receiver for the least amount of money of all these makers
I believe it was Voltaire that once said, "If you wish to have discourse with me, you must first define your terms." Meaning, you first have to define exactly what you are talking about so that it is clear to both parties. In this instance, the word "best" is subjective. Up to this point it has only been defined as, good, reliable, long lasting, and quality.

To others, good or best might be defined as something else with different criteria or requirements. With that said, this is really an easy question to answer if I understand what you are looking to attain.

LRB - $930
GLA - $950
Bula - $495

Since you stipulated you wanted a forged receiver and didn't require it be drop hammer forged, rather than press forged, or some other forging method such as SEI's idea of what a forged receiver actually is, then the obvious choice is Bula.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smal View Post
Coming from Ted Brown that says a mouth full also about what Im thinking also I'm wondering who puts out the best receiver for the money is a better way of putting what I'm trying to say,I know LRB and GWLA are great receivers but are there just as good ones for less money is Bula for instance as good as those two but a cheaper made thus you get more quality for your money? There also Hammer forged right why would GWLA or LRB be a better receiver for the money than say a Bula are the specs better on the LRB and the GWLA I'm actually trying to make up my mind which to buy also.I want a good quality receiver but whats the difference,I know some are hammer forged and some are cast etc and I'm wanting a Hammer forged but why would I want a LRB or a GWLA over a Bula or vice versa and why is Bula so much cheaper?
All the other companies you listed as potential candidates for your next forged receiver had to outsource the machining, forgings, or a plethora of a hundred different things. Bula can do it all in house and save money. They can then pass the savings on to the customer after they begin to get some of their investment back. I wouldn't use the term cheap to describe their receivers though. Maybe a better wording is, less expensive than the other makers.

Good luck on your Winchester build and let us know how it comes out. Most of us enjoy pictures, target shots, and experiences shared. Since you already built a Fulton, you shouldn't have any problems with whatever you choose.
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  #13  
Old 08-17-2018, 08:28 PM
Smal Smal is offline
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Originally Posted by TLB View Post
They all have their proponents and naysayers. They are tough to manufacture and many have their foibles. Almost all can be worked around, especially by a skilled 'smith. I have or have owned Armscorp, Bula, Polytech and SA Inc and would likely buy any again. All but the Polytech and one Bula started as a bare receiver.
I have built two off Fulton cast Receivers my first ones and they came out great no issues both shoot very well and I’m very happy with there product other than that thick rail that prevents you from putting on a full dummy kit to make it look as original as possiable I am skilled in working with many firearms just the M14 is fairly new to me so I’d like to do things right or as right as I am capable of when it comes to building one with little experience with them but what does help me is experience I have with the M1 and other military weapons I thank you also for the advice and constructive help and information very much


Quote:
Originally Posted by ZvenoMan View Post
You may consider thisM
There is plenty of info but you should seek it FIRST and then as specific questions. This forum and the M14 forum are obvious choices.
It really is as simple as Ford and Chevy. Note that not once in this thread has anyone said to avoid xxxxx brand.
Most threads discussing this will also suggest 2 things:
1. These are not ARs. Buying parts and assembling on the kithchen table will not go well. Many (most) require some hand fitting.
2. The builder is as, if not more important than the receiver brand.

If you simply want someone to tell you what to buy based on your post above then you may be disappointed.

Jh
. Just looking for the best quality receiver for the dollar is pretty much it at this point leaning to a forged one as I do not have one and I’m happy with both cast Fulton’s but would like to buy a forged one to compare hands on everyday shooting to see if there are differences that matter enough to spend the extra money on them in the long run or is forged and cast about the same when it comes to shooting them both and the difference is only in the process of how they are manufactured and maybe the forged will outlast the cast something I don’t think I’ll live long enough to see anyway so if you have any advice along those areas I’d sure appreciate it I have bought one ford in my life and no Chevys by the way if that matters


Quote:
Originally Posted by M14 View Post
I believe it was Voltaire that once said, "If you wish to have discourse with me, you must first define your terms." Meaning, you first have to define exactly what you are talking about so that it is clear to both parties. In this instance, the word "best" is subjective. Up to this point it has only been defined as, good, reliable, long lasting, and quality.

To others, good or best might be defined as something else with different criteria or requirements. With that said, this is really an easy question to answer if I understand what you are looking to attain.

LRB - $930
GLA - $950
Bula - $495

Since you stipulated you wanted a forged receiver and didn't require it be drop hammer forged, rather than press forged, or some other forging method such as SEI's idea of what a forged receiver actually is, then the obvious choice is Bula.

All the other companies you listed as potential candidates for your next forged receiver had to outsource the machining, forgings, or a plethora of a hundred different things. Bula can do it all in house and save money. They can then pass the savings on to the customer after they begin to get some of their investment back. I wouldn't use the term cheap to describe their receivers though. Maybe a better wording is, less expensive than the other makers.

Good luck on your Winchester build and let us know how it comes out. Most of us enjoy pictures, target shots, and experiences shared. Since you already built a Fulton, you shouldn't have any problems with whatever you choose.
Ahh well thank you one of the issues you also answered was price why is a Bula forged receiver so much less expensive than the LRB and GWLA etc I take it that because has the capibility to do it all in house and there is no difference much between LRB ,GW and Bula quality other than the methods they are produced? What I’m trying to do is pick all your brains and educate myself from your knowledge that I don’t have is all so sorry if some of my questions are not quite on all of you alls level I’m just doing the best I can to learn about them and I read quite a bit being retired
When I was referring to Bula being cheaper if you reread what I was talking about it was involveing cost not quality of product.

What’s confusing is what you read about company’s and how they do produce products then the water gets kinda muddy when you read online what a lot of others have to say about products they produce a lot of it being back and forth comments about who’s method of producing receivers is best I’m not here to be picked apart because of questions I ask that may seem to have simple answers to you but to someone who does not know about receiver bridge measurements and why this is good over that etc I don’t have a clue so I’m sure some of my questions may not be technical as I’m no machinist I’m a hobby builder that likes building guns shooting them but I have no machining skills at all so my silly questions may not be on the same level but it still would be nice to be able to discuss them with out being belittled for asking such stupid questions
M14 you said ,Since you already built a Fulton, you shouldn't have any problems with whatever you choose.
So If I can build on a Fulton then I should have no problems building on any Hammer forged, drop forged etc receivers as I saw in some posts earlier they claimed you would need a gunsmith to tweak the receivers if built on some of those,So there all pretty much the same build wise if you can build on one you should be able to build on any receiver made?


Quote:
Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
For someone that would like to do the work themselves, Fulton seems to be the easiest to do , at least the 2 I have were. CMP kits made rifles out of them as I observed. Magic.
Exactly why my first builds went on those I was not an expert M14 builder and and that being the case the Fulton receivers seemed to be a good fit for me at the time with basic build kits as when it comes to the expensive stocks and all the equipment you can add on I’m still checking all that out and seeing what best fits me as a shooter and not what everyone says is the latest and greatest thing to buy and hang off your rifle kind of stuff I’ve seen some guys with A R 15 rifles that look like Christmas trees with so much clutter on them half the stuff they may not even know how to use lol

Last edited by Big_Red; 08-18-2018 at 03:26 AM. Reason: Shotgun posting
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  #14  
Old 08-18-2018, 07:04 PM
mac1911 mac1911 is offline
 
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I bought a few kits from cmp when they came out. I later sold them to someone who made a offer i could not refuse. for what ever reason i remember receivers
Being pretty expensive even compared to todays prices? Any how i swore off the M1a "again" and basically said i would not buy one unless to cheap to pass up.
Well it happened 1st i got a deal on 4 mags i really had no use for but cheap enough i could not say no.
Then the dupage parts kits came around last month and again the price was "cheap" enough for me to grab one. Then I found a JRA/Rock Ola/bula receiver for $500 locally so no shipping or FFL transfer fees.

Now to my point.
I have been reading and hearing about all the manufactures listed in the previous post for.... Well since i bought those cmp kits.
SAI had the "cast" reciever issues, others had XYZ wrong with them. What it finally came down to for me when i chose the JRA/rock ola/bula receiver < now i still have not found anything that says who actually "made" this receiver it has both "names" on it.
i decided on 2 simple concepts. Company and price/availability. i just had to drive 10min to the club and buy it. JRA has been around a bit and the few rifles i have seen from them all looked nice and worked.
I also ruled out the "expenive" options as i did not see any real gains for the more expensive ooptions. Im building a "as issued" rifle from GI kit. The most "accurizing" done is shiming the gas cylinder and maybe nurling the barrel lower band area?

As much as i would like a LRB with intergrated scope mount im not dropping this in a $1000 chasis with a $2000 scope. Not that i would even do that with a M1a. i rather dump that into a bolt gun.

So moving on . You buy what you feel comfortable with just because its $500 or $1000 does not mean one will be worse or better than the other.

Now as far as "building" a M1a from parts. Come on its not to hard. Now knowing what to do with a problem arises is the "smart" part. This is where a skilled "smith" gets his nod.
I think anyone today who can read and search the net and is not afraid to talk to people can figure out how to assemble a M1a to a safe functioning rifle. The most accurate or dependable is a different story.
12 years ago if you asked me to "build" a AR or M1 Garand or take a beat to sknot lucky to hit the berm 8mm mauser into a 10 ringer i would have said NFW.
A few garand builds in 308 and 06 later and some barrel installs later im not a pro but confident enough to do it and shoot gold scores at local cmp matches.

Have fun and if you have known details , pictures, papers, or anything else to prove on thing or another about a manufacture please tell us.

Build well and shoot often.....

i hope to have my M1a finished mid week and at a cmp match on 9/9
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  #15  
Old 08-18-2018, 07:20 PM
nf1e nf1e is online now
 
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Well said mac1911.
The M14 type rifle can be a fun project and actually very easy to assemble.
The mystique of requiring special master gunsmith capabilities is just that, smoke and mirrors in an attempt to place necessary abilities above those of mortal man.
Any individual with a basic mechanical aptitude and some common sense can put a safe and perfectly functioning accurate rifle together quite easily.
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  #16  
Old 08-19-2018, 02:40 PM
mac1911 mac1911 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
Well said mac1911.
The M14 type rifle can be a fun project and actually very easy to assemble.
The mystique of requiring special master gunsmith capabilities is just that, smoke and mirrors in an attempt to place necessary abilities above those of mortal man.
Any individual with a basic mechanical aptitude and some common sense can put a safe and perfectly functioning accurate rifle together quite easily.
I did not have access to a computer other than going to the library when i first started asking around about a new barrel on a M1 i owned.
When asking it was like vodo.....ohhh barrel timing, finish reaming , special tools. Had me scared for a bit.
Plus no local smiths would touch it. Also after a few bad smith issues i said enough and just started doing things myself. Then i bought a house and the internet!
Barrel timing tighten barrel until sights are level
Some how barrel timing sound mysterious back then.
Oh and special tools-_yeah day in and day out building sure but my first barrel install was a small shop press some oak blocks and a large adjustable wrench....later i bought the cmp barrel tool head and 3 way reciever wrench, pull tbrough reamer , HS gauges and so on. Im not a smith and i dont do much work for others. I cheaped out on the M1a build it was same money to have smith barrel up and finish ream as it would be for me to get the reamer and barrel wrench. Should get it back soon.
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  #17  
Old 08-20-2018, 08:01 AM
Ironsight01 Ironsight01 is offline
 
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If you want a integrated rail on your build the Bula M21 dmr with said rail is only a hundred dollars more than the standard and you won't have to buy a $150 separate mount to put a scope on it.
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  #18  
Old 08-20-2018, 08:38 AM
Smal Smal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mac1911 View Post
I bought a few kits from cmp when they came out. I later sold them to someone who made a offer i could not refuse. for what ever reason i remember receivers
Being pretty expensive even compared to todays prices? Any how i swore off the M1a "again" and basically said i would not buy one unless to cheap to pass up.
Well it happened 1st i got a deal on 4 mags i really had no use for but cheap enough i could not say no.
Then the dupage parts kits came around last month and again the price was "cheap" enough for me to grab one. Then I found a JRA/Rock Ola/bula receiver for $500 locally so no shipping or FFL transfer fees.

Now to my point.
I have been reading and hearing about all the manufactures listed in the previous post for.... Well since i bought those cmp kits.
SAI had the "cast" reciever issues, others had XYZ wrong with them. What it finally came down to for me when i chose the JRA/rock ola/bula receiver < now i still have not found anything that says who actually "made" this receiver it has both "names" on it.
i decided on 2 simple concepts. Company and price/availability. i just had to drive 10min to the club and buy it. JRA has been around a bit and the few rifles i have seen from them all looked nice and worked.
I also ruled out the "expenive" options as i did not see any real gains for the more expensive ooptions. Im building a "as issued" rifle from GI kit. The most "accurizing" done is shiming the gas cylinder and maybe nurling the barrel lower band area?

As much as i would like a LRB with intergrated scope mount im not dropping this in a $1000 chasis with a $2000 scope. Not that i would even do that with a M1a. i rather dump that into a bolt gun.

So moving on . You buy what you feel comfortable with just because its $500 or $1000 does not mean one will be worse or better than the other.

Now as far as "building" a M1a from parts. Come on its not to hard. Now knowing what to do with a problem arises is the "smart" part. This is where a skilled "smith" gets his nod.
I think anyone today who can read and search the net and is not afraid to talk to people can figure out how to assemble a M1a to a safe functioning rifle. The most accurate or dependable is a different story.
12 years ago if you asked me to "build" a AR or M1 Garand or take a beat to sknot lucky to hit the berm 8mm mauser into a 10 ringer i would have said NFW.
A few garand builds in 308 and 06 later and some barrel installs later im not a pro but confident enough to do it and shoot gold scores at local cmp matches.

Have fun and if you have known details , pictures, papers, or anything else to prove on thing or another about a manufacture please tell us.

Build well and shoot often.....

i hope to have my M1a finished mid week and at a cmp match on 9/9
Mac thats pretty much about how i was feeling about Receivers etc when I was asking about them,You do your homework as everyone seems to think no one does and when your doing that homework all you see is people bickering about this one or that ones receiver because its .00001 off in some area or another that I have no idea if its going to matter or blow up the gun so I read all this ummm stuff try to make heads or tails out of which one is really a good receiver and by the time you think ok ill get one of those and next thing ya know they're out of business. I think everything you have said above is about what my line of thoughts was and a little more,Im thinking staying with an established maker who has been around a while protects me in the long run and they're usually not the most expensive because those guys end up out of business because they can't compete with the guys making the less expensive receivers that seem to me to be just as good shooting wise other than there not hammer forged or drop hammer forged or whatever,

The two Fulton Receivers I have already built work great never any issues putting them together and both shoot very well and from what it looks like they're going to be here a while too,The only thing I do not like is Id like to have me one with a dummy kit on it so I'm thinking Bula would be the best pick for me at this point as there inexpensive most people seem to like the quality of the receiver it will take a dummy kit if this dummy can figure that one out and I think with there pricing and the product they're putting out there going to be in the biz for the long haul if they can remain competitive producing the product they are now and still make money and I am thinking they can do that I was a little leery in the begining as they are a fairly new producer of M14 products and I sure did not want to jump on the bula bus like so many did soon as they show up in town with there product,I tend to sit back and watch what happens before I drop 5 or 6 hundred on something,.

So far that's saved me some money on a lot of things but thank you very much for your insight Mac always the wise one in the group here. Have a good one, Jim

Quote:
Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
Well said mac1911.
The M14 type rifle can be a fun project and actually very easy to assemble.
The mystique of requiring special master gunsmith capabilities is just that, smoke and mirrors in an attempt to place necessary abilities above those of mortal man.
Any individual with a basic mechanical aptitude and some common sense can put a safe and perfectly functioning accurate rifle together quite easily.
And that's exactly what I was thinking, I did my homework rest assured before I asked this question but what I found a lot of was this receiver is better than this one because of those ones out of spec by so many thousands which to me I have no clue if that matters at all when it comes down to which receiver is a better one to build on and if it makes any difference, I do not think any mass-produced receivers are going to be 100% perfect esp in a time of a War and the lowest bidder gets the contracts and is expected to crank those rifles out as quickly as they can and in that case can a GI Receiver be improved on in today's modern world of manufacturing equipment to better standards and design over the original designs.

I'm thinking today's M14 or M1A receivers are much safer built than the ones in the 50,s and 60,s so it's actually safer for us Mortal Men to give it a go! And If you can build an M1 Garand as similar as the M14 is Id think most could take on an M14 build successfully and not lose there head in the process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mac1911 View Post
I did not have access to a computer other than going to the library when i first started asking around about a new barrel on a M1 i owned.
When asking it was like vodo.....ohhh barrel timing, finish reaming , special tools. Had me scared for a bit.
Plus no local smiths would touch it. Also after a few bad smith issues i said enough and just started doing things myself. Then i bought a house and the internet!
Barrel timing tighten barrel until sights are level
Some how barrel timing sound mysterious back then.
Oh and special tools-_yeah day in and day out building sure but my first barrel install was a small shop press some oak blocks and a large adjustable wrench....later i bought the cmp barrel tool head and 3 way reciever wrench, pull tbrough reamer , HS gauges and so on. Im not a smith and i dont do much work for others. I cheaped out on the M1a build it was same money to have smith barrel up and finish ream as it would be for me to get the reamer and barrel wrench. Should get it back soon.
Thats exactly how my first build went lol and I was also intimidated by all the big words and lingo and the fear of blowing myself up if i did not get this or that exactly right and Barrel timing get a couple rods set one on the back of the receiver and one on the front sight post and see if they line up looking at them from behind the receiver ,oh let me tell you what that some difficult technical stuff there esp on an AR-15 barrel instal with that little notch and slot you line up , Wow that was a scary build there,let me tell ya ,I had the whole neighborhood evacuated before I pulled the trigger on that first one.

Seems to me there is a lot of lingo tossed around to make some tasks more difficult than they really are and the price goes up for the unknowing along with the difficulty level of how the lingo sounds,lol And throw that word custom in there and you best be off to the bank and hope the Brinks trucks been there already, I understand completely what your saying and its the gospel that's for sure,Once you find out just how easy tasks such as finish reaming etc are and the short time it takes to do it ,I just shook my head and thought if a fella that knew what he was doing went in to business and charged a fair price for these tasks OMG he would be rich if he could keep up with the workload.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironsight01 View Post
If you want a integrated rail on your build the Bula M21 dmr with said rail is only a hundred dollars more than the standard and you won't have to buy a $150 separate mount to put a scope on it.
There you go, someone, down at Bula was thinking and it's a solid mount and is going to shoot well id suspect, But I have never owned a Bula so I'm thinking I'm about to buy me one of there receivers shortly,With all the good input we have got here I am thinking that's the best horse in the show and that's exactly what I was looking for was input and how did people like them that owned any of the receivers and it seems Bula for the money which is also what I was looking for the best buy for the money is a hand,s down winner. Now I have to check out all the options such as the one you just brought up and if I want a permanent rail there or not,I guess I'll be looking into those any good deals on them anywhere presently,I also got in on a good deal on a Kit someplace another Winchester with a beautiful stock and parts.

Last edited by Big_Red; 08-21-2018 at 02:33 AM. Reason: Shotgun posting again
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  #19  
Old 08-20-2018, 09:42 AM
nf1e nf1e is online now
 
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Here is a couple of M21 DMRs just mentioned that I nailed together last year.
This receiver gives the shooter the best of both worlds, iron sights and a rock solid scope mount without the expense of a side mount.

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  #20  
Old 08-20-2018, 09:50 AM
Smal Smal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
Here is a couple of M21 DMRs just mentioned that I nailed together last year.
This receiver gives the shooter the best of both worlds, iron sights and a rock solid scope mount without the expense of a side mount.


Ahh that's awesome I thought with the integrated scope mounts I was going to lose my Iron sight capability, That's what my concern was over that one but its a see-thru Iron sight under the rail? If that's the case I think I'll be getting that one right there but I'll still look at what they have but that's what I'm looking for,, Good Input thank you very much! It's nice to be able to talk about something and not have so much negativity around or berateing people etc,I appreciate it and the pics!

nf1e ,I have seen pics of your M1A,s and their beautiful rifles you have, but I don't think you have enough you should get a few more! lol I saw the picture you had of them all laid out on a day and that's a phenomenal collection, I'm sure its taken you a few years to put that together.

Last edited by Big_Red; 08-21-2018 at 02:32 AM. Reason: Shotgun posting again
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