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  #1  
Old 06-29-2019, 12:01 PM
dcarroll dcarroll is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Augusta, MT
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Default scope level

Is a scope level allowed on a CMP Service Rifle (optic--ar15)?
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  #2  
Old 06-29-2019, 04:30 PM
champ0608 champ0608 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: AZ
Posts: 147
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I'm not a rule expert, so this is only opinion.

I believe the CMP rules operate under "if its not specifically allowed, it is not allowed." Being that the CMP and the NRA rules don't mention scope levels anywhere in their outline of service rifles, I'd say they are not allowed.

Furthermore, it just seems like they wouldn't be. But then again, who ever saw the current state of "service rifles" coming?
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  #3  
Old 06-29-2019, 04:49 PM
dcarroll dcarroll is offline
 
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That is what I was thinking. Thanks.
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  #4  
Old 07-29-2019, 07:58 AM
ceresco ceresco is offline
 
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Some of the inexpensive AR15 mounts that have levels built in. I can't see them being of any value and a screwdriver tip will remove them.... Good Shooting. ..
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  #5  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:58 AM
gorby223 gorby223 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 23
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If its not specifically allowed, then its not allowed.

That being said, are scope caps/ lens reducers/ peep sights allowed?
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  #6  
Old 01-12-2020, 10:13 PM
rickgman rickgman is offline
 
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Location: Michigan
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Since scope levels are of virtually no benefit on the flat range, I see no reason that they should be disallowed. However, I would suggest contacting the CMP and getting a read on their opinion because their opinion is the only one that counts.
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  #7  
Old 01-13-2020, 01:38 PM
X Hunter X Hunter is offline
 
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I believe a level is a benefit, with 3 degrees of cant on a scope, at 600 yards and no wind, you will be hitting the edge of a rattle battle target instead of center.
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  #8  
Old 01-13-2020, 06:28 PM
rickgman rickgman is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X Hunter View Post
I believe a level is a benefit, with 3 degrees of cant on a scope, at 600 yards and no wind, you will be hitting the edge of a rattle battle target instead of center.
Well, on any good range you can pretty well identify level by the line of targets. The horizontal crosshair is a great reference when combined with the line of targets.

A 3 deg cant at 600 yds. makes a difference of a little over 1 MOA but that isn't huge unless you are shooting at a relatively small target. The black of an MR target is 6 MOA total so the affect of a cant of 3 deg will put you somewhere on the edge of the 10 ring (which is 2 MOA wide) or slightly into the 9 ring - assuming everything else is spot on.

Shooting at E type targets (as used in the Battle Rattle) at long range can be problematic. The target which is 1/2 meter wide constitutes a smaler and smaller angle as the range increases. Unlike bullseye targets, the E type target doesn't get larger as range increases. E type targets are easy to hit at short ranges but not so much at longer ranges. An E type target is 6.66 MOA wide at 600 yds. and anything off center by 3.33 is scored as a zero. If you shoot off center by 3.33 MOA on an MR-1 target you score an 8.

On the flat range, I worry more about wind than cant since with a scope, I don't think I will have a cant of 3 deg.

Scope levels are a huge benefit at longer ranges when there is no horizontal level reference present - like in the real world.

Just my two cents worth.
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  #9  
Old 01-13-2020, 07:29 PM
X Hunter X Hunter is offline
 
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"A 3 deg cant at 600 yds. makes a difference of a little over 1 MOA but that isn't huge unless you are shooting at a relatively small target. The black of an MR target is 6 MOA total so the affect of a cant of 3 deg will put you somewhere on the edge of the 10 ring (which is 2 MOA wide) or slightly into the 9 ring - assuming everything else is spot on."

I think shooting X's and 10's is huge compared to shooting 10's and 9's.
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  #10  
Old 01-13-2020, 08:20 PM
rickgman rickgman is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X Hunter View Post
"A 3 deg cant at 600 yds. makes a difference of a little over 1 MOA but that isn't huge unless you are shooting at a relatively small target. The black of an MR target is 6 MOA total so the affect of a cant of 3 deg will put you somewhere on the edge of the 10 ring (which is 2 MOA wide) or slightly into the 9 ring - assuming everything else is spot on."

I think shooting X's and 10's is huge compared to shooting 10's and 9's.
I think that a 3 deg cant is unlikely on a flat range especially when using a scope. Even if it does exist, it likely isn't the predominant source of error. In almost all cases wind is a greater potential source of error. An error in your wind call of 2 mph at 600 yds is about 1.2 MOA. A gust of 2 mph above or below the average wind call also equates to about 1.2 MOA.
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