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  #1  
Old 07-19-2017, 05:24 PM
rubicon762 rubicon762 is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Greater Cleveland, Ohio
Posts: 222
Default From Iron sights to Scope: Lessons learned?

I'm 55 years old and my eyes are getting worse not better.

I've been into Service Rifle (seriously) for 3 years. Knoblach glasses helped a LOT, but I'm certain going to a scope (like many on the line at the 2017 NM) will help me reach my goals.

What are the lesson's that those of you who have switched, learned?
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  #2  
Old 07-19-2017, 06:16 PM
missilegeek missilegeek is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: AL
Posts: 1,876
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rubicon762 View Post
I'm 55 years old and my eyes are getting worse not better.

I've been into Service Rifle (seriously) for 3 years. Knoblach glasses helped a LOT, but I'm certain going to a scope (like many on the line at the 2017 NM) will help me reach my goals.

What are the lesson's that those of you who have switched, learned?
You should ask that (or do a search) on the nationalmatch forums, if you haven't already. You're more likely to get a detailed answer.
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Service Rifle: 1884-2015 RIP.
Service Pistol: 1903-2014
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  #3  
Old 07-19-2017, 09:29 PM
rickgman rickgman is online now
 
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Location: Michigan
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The top shooters seem to be using Nightforce or March scopes. In many ways, it's a cost / performance trade-off. Inexpensive scopes have issues with tracking, hysteresis and adjustment precision so they are totally inadequate for service rifle competition. There are a number of intermediate priced scopes that generally do not have these issues and will work well - at least in the short term. However, some might suffer from reliability issues once they are used extensively. A rifle used in service rifle competition experiences lots of wear and tear on the elevation and windage adjustment mechanisms. If you go with the high priced scopes, you will likely have no long term issues. It all boils down to how much are you willing to pay.
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  #4  
Old 07-20-2017, 08:54 AM
10thmountain 10thmountain is offline
 
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Location: Marietta, GA
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Great info. I hope one day they make a scoped rifle class and iron sights class.
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  #5  
Old 07-20-2017, 01:06 PM
rickgman rickgman is online now
 
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Location: Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10thmountain View Post
I hope one day they make a scoped rifle class and iron sights class.
That outwardly seems to be a good solution to the concerns of many but there is a hidden problem. That problem is that it now becomes potentially hard to get leg points at matches with smaller attendance. There might not be enough shooters in your class to obtain points or the points might be severely limited. I think that the best bet is to go with the hardware that you can shoot best for the least overall cost. If you can shoot well with iron sights, go with iron sights. If optics offer you better performance, go with optics. Select your optics based on how much money you are willing to spend and how much you plan on using your optics. For most folks, a good quality medium priced optical sight like a Leupold is a good bet. It might not have the appeal and long term durability of a Nightforce or March scope but it has a lifetime warranty and if it does have wear issues, it can be repaired free of charge.
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  #6  
Old 07-20-2017, 05:36 PM
10thmountain 10thmountain is offline
 
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Rickgman - well thought out. I see your point with total competitors making up a match. Maybe the cmp could add the A2 as a separate class for fun matches.
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  #7  
Old 07-21-2017, 07:47 AM
milprileb milprileb is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Stafford, Virginia
Posts: 2,238
Question

I am curious, has the "scores" greatly elevated now that optics are allowed for Service Rifle competition ?

Thank you for your experience on this .
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  #8  
Old 07-21-2017, 09:06 AM
Gewehr43 Gewehr43 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Denver, CO
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I've been collecting the "cut" info and here's what I found:
  • 2010: 891 elig shooters cut: 470.4 top: 492.17
  • 2011: 866 elig shooters cut: 469.9 top: 488.17
  • 2012: 840 elig shooters cut: 467.3 top: 491.16
  • 2013: 845 elig shooters cut: 471.9 top: 493.17
  • 2014: 684 elig shooters cut: 467.9 top: 488.13
  • 2015: 711 elig shooters cut: 468.6 top: 489.16
  • 2016: 761 elig shooters cut: 469.10 top: 492.15
  • 2017: 697 elig shooters cut: 474.11 top: 496.23
So we really only have 2 years now of info regarding the inclusion of scopes.



And before you jump on the idea that the cut jumped this year....... I'm collecting the cuts from the mid 90's and the 474 cut is repeated several times, atleast once with the M14...............


I'm going to collect "the data" and post it separately ............
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  #9  
Old 07-21-2017, 09:34 AM
missilegeek missilegeek is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gewehr43 View Post
I've been collecting the "cut" info and here's what I found:
  • 2010: 891 elig shooters cut: 470.4 top: 492.17
  • 2011: 866 elig shooters cut: 469.9 top: 488.17
  • 2012: 840 elig shooters cut: 467.3 top: 491.16
  • 2013: 845 elig shooters cut: 471.9 top: 493.17
  • 2014: 684 elig shooters cut: 467.9 top: 488.13
  • 2015: 711 elig shooters cut: 468.6 top: 489.16
  • 2016: 761 elig shooters cut: 469.10 top: 492.15
  • 2017: 697 elig shooters cut: 474.11 top: 496.23
So we really only have 2 years now of info regarding the inclusion of scopes.



And before you jump on the idea that the cut jumped this year....... I'm collecting the cuts from the mid 90's and the 474 cut is repeated several times, atleast once with the M14...............


I'm going to collect "the data" and post it separately ............

There were more 490+ scores than usual.
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Service Rifle: 1884-2015 RIP.
Service Pistol: 1903-2014
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  #10  
Old 07-21-2017, 11:19 AM
Gewehr43 Gewehr43 is offline
 
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Location: Denver, CO
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I didn't look at it that way.............
When I have time I'll post the cuts (and other info) from 1972 onwards.

But looking that far back........... the cut meanders but it is in a range of around 467 to 472ish....There are outliers..... a low of 461 in 1988.

The 2017 cut was beat three times: 1981 (M14) with a 475.10, 2001 (AR?) with 475.9 and 2003 with a 475.5.

But having shot it............ conditions were very good. Hot humid but if you could focus...........good scores.
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Service Rifle.... RIP .... 1884-2015

Last edited by Gewehr43; 07-21-2017 at 11:22 AM.
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