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  #21  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:32 PM
Ted Brown Ted Brown is offline
 
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When I was shooting the Garand at 1000 yards the target was a 5V which was somewhat more forgiving than the 10X target. However the Garand had no trouble keeping on target.

I switched to the M14 in 1976 and found it was more than able to hold the 10 and X ring at 1000 when I did my part. I don't know where the figure of 10 feet in a ten MPH wind came from. According to my wind charts it only takes 10 clicks of a half minute sight to center a shot in a 10 MPH wind. I did have the experience of shooting in high winds at 29 Palms during a 1000 yard match. I shot with 24 clicks of left windage and aimed at the target to the left of mine. That equates to about 240 minutes! Bullet drop is not a factor. That's why we have adjustable sights. I always filed down my front sight so the rifle would shoot with four to five clicks of elevation at 200 yards. The helped prevent neck strain from having sights adjusted too high at long range. I almost always shot 180 grain bullets at 1000 yards in the M14. I learned about 168's the hard way. Funny thing is that I still shot 178 with the bullets tumbling through the target. I thought it wasn't all that bad... We didn't have the 175 SMK back then.
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  #22  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:46 PM
canes7 canes7 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Brown View Post
When I was shooting the Garand at 1000 yards the target was a 5V which was somewhat more forgiving than the 10X target. However the Garand had no trouble keeping on target.

I switched to the M14 in 1976 and found it was more than able to hold the 10 and X ring at 1000 when I did my part. I don't know where the figure of 10 feet in a ten MPH wind came from. According to my wind charts it only takes 10 clicks of a half minute sight to center a shot in a 10 MPH wind. I did have the experience of shooting in high winds at 29 Palms during a 1000 yard match. I shot with 24 clicks of left windage and aimed at the target to the left of mine. That equates to about 240 minutes! Bullet drop is not a factor. That's why we have adjustable sights. I always filed down my front sight so the rifle would shoot with four to five clicks of elevation at 200 yards. The helped prevent neck strain from having sights adjusted too high at long range. I almost always shot 180 grain bullets at 1000 yards in the M14. I learned about 168's the hard way. Funny thing is that I still shot 178 with the bullets tumbling through the target. I thought it wasn't all that bad... We didn't have the 175 SMK back then.
Great story. Thanks Ted.
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  #23  
Old 09-12-2017, 10:07 PM
gmerkt gmerkt is offline
 
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Interesting thread, thanks for the many contributions. It's probably too late in the game at my age to launch into 1000 yard marksmanship. I was down at the Sierra Vista, AZ range about 10 years ago, they have a 600 yard range, I could barely make out the target. I took a few shots at it, saw my rounds puff some dust off rocks way below the target, had serious sight adjustment to do. On that trip, I had only some 150 gr. bullet ammo for spontaneous shooting stops along the way, not for any serious distance shooting. But I always have an M1 Rifle in the car on my trips.

Oh, I don't know, I think if someone were shooting at me from 1000 yards away and the bullets were yawing and flying a bit wide, I'd still keep my head down!
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  #24  
Old 09-13-2017, 07:16 AM
milprileb milprileb is offline
 
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Location: Stafford, Virginia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sakorick View Post
I don't want to rain on anybody's parade but with a 10 MPH Xwind, the bullet drifts slightly over 10 feet in 1000 yards. I don't think there are enough clicks in a M1 Garand rear sight to move the POI 10 feet at that range. So essentially we are talking about luck here. The bullet also drops about 415 inches which is 34 feet. I rest my case.
Sir, what got me back on the trek to 1000 yds with M1 is two events:

a. My M1A will do 11 inch groups with 175 SMK's at 1000 yds
b. My 03A4 Gibbs clone sniper rifle did a 173 with 1x out of 200 pts at our sniper match last weekend with 175 SMK's at 1000 yds. So I know 3006
will hold to 1000 yds with my loads.

Our club has the old bulls eyes on KD frames for 1000 yd Garand shooting per Teds comments. So, its all up to me to take M1 out to 800 and then 1000 yds and pull it all together.

I can tell you are doubtful by your post but if you read comments in this thread and do some research, the M1 was used out to 1000 yds many many years in the past. Those days are long gone but the rifle had the "legs" to do it.
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  #25  
Old 09-13-2017, 08:05 AM
RVN 69-70 RVN 69-70 is offline
 
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Default 1000 Yards

Quote:
Originally Posted by milprileb View Post
Sir, what got me back on the trek to 1000 yds with M1 is two events:

a. My M1A will do 11 inch groups with 175 SMK's at 1000 yds
b. My 03A4 Gibbs clone sniper rifle did a 173 with 1x out of 200 pts at our sniper match last weekend with 175 SMK's at 1000 yds. So I know 3006
will hold to 1000 yds with my loads.

Our club has the old bulls eyes on KD frames for 1000 yd Garand shooting per Teds comments. So, its all up to me to take M1 out to 800 and then 1000 yds and pull it all together.

I can tell you are doubtful by your post but if you read comments in this thread and do some research, the M1 was used out to 1000 yds many many years in the past. Those days are long gone but the rifle had the "legs" to do it.
WELL...if SOMEONE can do it, YOU can. Let us know the outcome....
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  #26  
Old 09-13-2017, 11:54 AM
Ted Brown Ted Brown is offline
 
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At 1000 Yards the 7.62 with any bullet is at it's limit. The .30-06 is good out to 1200 or more. Something to think about...
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  #27  
Old 09-13-2017, 02:52 PM
jimthompson502002 jimthompson502002 is offline
 
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Not that it matters, but I got better-than-decent results in .308 with the 190 grain BTHP's at 1000 meters.

These were introduced in the early sixties, and yes, careful load workup allows them to be used in semi-automatic gas guns, particularly in .308, where the more uniform velocities pay off.

https://www.sierrabullets.com/store/...HPBT-MatchKing

The 200's also worked well, but recoil becomes an issue. Actually, it's an issue well before that, but at 200, one must be very, very careful with loads AND lubrication. That old "differential speed" admonition about the rod is correct!!

I did eventually quit trying to keep them supersonic, which becomes very awkward with either chambering.

I also eventually discarded the variable gas cylinder lock screw.

None of my .30/06 workups were close.

The real issue is often UNIFORMITY of velocity, not just "high muzzle velocity", which is why many of the purpose-built .300 WinMag "competition" rifles won't do as well as the M1's. Developing loads for consistency with the big Magnum cases can be difficult.

Oddly, the 7x57 rifle I had built almost by accident did even better with 175-grain match pills.

Yes, those were ALL M1 Garands.

Last edited by jimthompson502002; 09-18-2017 at 08:37 PM. Reason: detail
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  #28  
Old 09-13-2017, 03:05 PM
Mike in NC Mike in NC is online now
 
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Not surprised the 7mm with the 175 grain match bullets worked so well. I would think the BC (Ballistic Coefficient) on the 7mm bullet is better than the 190 grain 30 cal. I would think a 7 x 57 Garand would be nice rifle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimthompson502002 View Post
Not that it matters, but I got better-than-decent results in .308 with the 190 grain BTHP's at 1000 meters.

I did eventually quit trying to keep them supersonic, which becomes very awkward with either chambering.

I also eventually discarded the variable gas cylinder lock screw.

None of my .30/06 workups were close.

Oddly, the 7x57 rifle I had built almost by accident did even better with 175-grain match pills.

Yes, those were ALL M1 Garands.
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  #29  
Old 09-13-2017, 03:34 PM
echo6mike echo6mike is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stripper clip View Post
From what I've read, the 168 grain bullet generally won't stay supersonic at 1000 yards due to the B.C. of the bullet. Therefore, the 173 grain, 175 grain Sierra, or the 178 grain Hornady; the ballistic coefficients are better. The old 1000 yard bullseye targets I have are 6'x6' with a 48" bull. The M-1 should be fun at that distance. I've never shot the Garand out to 1000, but rather one of my 1918 Rock Island M1903's.
Ah, yes. That makes sense on the bullet weights for distance. 168gr should be good for 200/300, maybe 600? yards. I'll find some heavier rounds for 1000 yards.

It looks like for a short range like mine, the SR-1 target is the one to use for simulating the 200 yard range. If I can get good dope for that, should I be okay to start for the longer ranges?

Also, if I'm sighting in at 100 yards with the smaller target, I'm thinking I should keep the elevation set down for 100, then when I get to an actual 200 yard line click it up to 200? Since the target will be sized for 200 yards, but the bullet trajectory will still be ending at 100 yards.

How do other folks with short ranges for practice handle this?

s/f
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  #30  
Old 09-13-2017, 04:22 PM
Shomway Shomway is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echo6mike View Post
Ah, yes. That makes sense on the bullet weights for distance. 168gr should be good for 200/300, maybe 600? yards. I'll find some heavier rounds for 1000 yards.

It looks like for a short range like mine, the SR-1 target is the one to use for simulating the 200 yard range. If I can get good dope for that, should I be okay to start for the longer ranges?

Also, if I'm sighting in at 100 yards with the smaller target, I'm thinking I should keep the elevation set down for 100, then when I get to an actual 200 yard line click it up to 200? Since the target will be sized for 200 yards, but the bullet trajectory will still be ending at 100 yards.

How do other folks with short ranges for practice handle this?

s/f
Sighted in at 100 yards, I use this as a reference....FWIW
100-200=3 clicks
200-300=3 clicks
300-400=4 clicks
400-500=4 clicks
500-600=5 clicks
600-700=5 clicks
700-800=6 clicks
800-900=8 clicks
900-1000=8 clicks
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