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  #11  
Old 12-15-2019, 03:03 PM
rcolarco rcolarco is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC 00-08 View Post
I didn't realize I could drop below the 14.0 grain minimum listed in the manual. I'll have to try that out.

My carbine shoots low. Using the 25yd M1 Carbine target that says it is from page 53 of TM 9-1276, I have to set the rear sight at 300 using a 6 o'clock hold to get about an inch inside the dotted line. The rear sight at 250 puts me just below the dotted line. Maybe I need to file the front sight down but I really don't want to do that.

I should mention that the 1 inch groups I talked about in post #7 was done at 25yds from a bench using sand bags. I don't normally shoot the carbine like that but did since I was trying to test the accuracy of the reloads vs factory ammo.
Check out loads for the .30 Carbine for pistols and revolvers. The Hornady manual goes down to 8.7 grains of H110. The unverified and cannot duplicate "explosions" with light loads seem to be put to bed with this tested and verified data. I load cartridges for my Ruger revolver at these levels.

Now, a big caution. A very light load may stick a bullet in the longer carbine barrel. Because the gas port is so near the chamber, it is possible for a bullet to pass the gas port, cycle the action normally, and stick further down the barrel. The next shot blows the gun.

I do not go below minimum rifle loads in my rifles.

Tread carefully.
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  #12  
Old 12-15-2019, 04:51 PM
Unclenick Unclenick is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcolarco
The unverified and cannot duplicate "explosions" with light loads seem to be put to bed with this tested and verified data.
If you are talking about the warnings from Hodgdon and Winchester not to load this particular powder down (Hodgdon H10 and Winchester 296 are different names for the same canister grade Western Cannon 296 produced by the St. Marks plant), they were never about explosions of the cartridge itself. They were about a higher-than-normal propensity of light loads of this powder to occasionally squib out, leaving a bullet stuck in the barrel that the next round that doesn't squib out (most of them) can be fired into, causing gun damage by that mechanism.

If you are talking about low charges causing overpressure in general, the Late Dr. Lloyd Brownell said his lab had seen low case fill loads of rifle powder that unexpectedly produced twice the SAAMI MAP (well over the proof range) on a couple of occasions but that it was rare and the same loads normally just produced reduced pressures. There are plots in his 1965 study of low case fill loads showing pressure scattering all-around an average pressure value. He said the rare high-pressure excursions were a matter of statistical probability. They were a large number of standard deviations out on the tail of the pressure distribution, so they were extremely uncommon, but the probability was not zero. It was low enough that one person might load and shoot the load in question for years and never see a problem, while another person might have his gun break. This is in a CD of Handloader reprints on the subject of pressure that I bought from Wolfe Publishing a few years ago. Unfortunately, I no longer see it available.
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Last edited by Unclenick; 12-15-2019 at 04:56 PM.
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  #13  
Old 12-15-2019, 06:47 PM
USMC 00-08 USMC 00-08 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcolarco View Post

I do not go below minimum rifle loads in my rifles.

Tread carefully.
Good advice. I will stay between 14 and 15gr.
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  #14  
Old 12-16-2019, 01:04 PM
Pinecone Pinecone is offline
 
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What trimmer works well for carbine cases?

I use a WFT for shouldered cases.

Thanks.
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  #15  
Old 12-16-2019, 02:27 PM
Pappy Pappy is offline
 
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I use a Lyman universal. Seems once I trim then I don't have to do but a dozen or so after every firing for every hundred trimmed. Carbine brass has a mind of it's own. I use mostly R+P and Aguila brass
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  #16  
Old 12-18-2019, 09:03 AM
bigbird bigbird is offline
 
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I like the Lee trimmer it works well for me. As for my reloading I use 12.5 gn. of H110 and 110 gn. FMJ and it works well in my M1 Carbine. The COAL is normally 1.680 but I had the same problem you are experiencing with some bullets that the Ogiv was different and had to reseat them to 1.620 to get them to work properly with no problems at the range.
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  #17  
Old 12-18-2019, 09:09 AM
USriflecal30 USriflecal30 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC 00-08 View Post
I didn't realize I could drop below the 14.0 grain minimum listed in the manual. I'll have to try that out.

My carbine shoots low. Using the 25yd M1 Carbine target that says it is from page 53 of TM 9-1276, I have to set the rear sight at 300 using a 6 o'clock hold to get about an inch inside the dotted line. The rear sight at 250 puts me just below the dotted line. Maybe I need to file the front sight down but I really don't want to do that.

I should mention that the 1 inch groups I talked about in post #7 was done at 25yds from a bench using sand bags. I don't normally shoot the carbine like that but did since I was trying to test the accuracy of the reloads vs factory ammo.
Different manuals I guess. The Hornady 10th edition shows 13.0 to 14.9 gr of H110 for 110 gr RN bullets.
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  #18  
Old 12-21-2019, 10:02 PM
USMC 00-08 USMC 00-08 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbird View Post
The COAL is normally 1.680 but I had the same problem you are experiencing with some bullets that the Ogiv was different and had to reseat them to 1.620 to get them to work properly with no problems at the range.
I just went to the range today with 15 more rounds loaded with 14.5gr of W296 and had my COAL set at 1.665. This worked a lot better. I measured a pulled USGI bullet and it is .015 longer than the Everglades 110gr that I'm using. The ogive is different between the two.

Quote:
Originally Posted by USriflecal30 View Post
Different manuals I guess. The Hornady 10th edition shows 13.0 to 14.9 gr of H110 for 110 gr RN bullets.
Looking at different manuals, there does not seem to be the same load data published in them. Even COAL seems to vary with the same listed bullet. Measuring factory ammo and comparing it to what the manuals say and there is quite a difference there too.
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  #19  
Old 12-22-2019, 05:24 AM
rcolarco rcolarco is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC 00-08 View Post
Looking at different manuals, there does not seem to be the same load data published in them. Even COAL seems to vary with the same listed bullet. Measuring factory ammo and comparing it to what the manuals say and there is quite a difference there too.
If you can, use a loading manual published by the manufacturer of the bullet you are using. This will give you the best chance of producing good ammunition the first time out. Of course, some bullet manufacturers don't publish loading data. In that case, you are on your own.
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  #20  
Old 12-22-2019, 12:28 PM
Unclenick Unclenick is offline
 
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Assuming the bullet is cup and core construction in all cases, the other thing you can do to get a starting number is to match the seating depth to that of a published load. If you have, say, Hornady data, you can call Hornady and ask them how long their bullet is. Subtract that number from your bullet's length. Add the result to the COL Hornady has for their bullet to get your bullet's COL.

For example, if your bullet is shorter, the subtraction will give you a minus number. When you add that minus number to Hornady's COL, you will make it shorter (adding a negative number is the same as subtracting a positive number of the same magnitude). This is the starting COL to try with Hornady's load data.
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