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  #11  
Old 12-09-2016, 08:40 PM
S99VG S99VG is offline
 
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Rick - thanks for the info! Interesting that the Japanese army captured over 27,000 rifles before Bataan and Corregidor capitulated. They also got 63 automatic rifles which had to be early Garands as I don't think the Carbine and Thompson were issue arms at that time. So that leaves you wondering what condition those rifles were in (I assume 1903s and 1917s) at the time of capture and what became of them. I'd still be very cautious about any rifle advertised as a veteran of the early Philippine campaign without solid and indisputable provenance.

Last edited by S99VG; 12-10-2016 at 12:24 PM.
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  #12  
Old 12-11-2016, 08:40 PM
bayonetbilly bayonetbilly is offline
 
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Rifle, automatic = Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR), most likely.

One or two M1s appear to be in the upper left-hand corner of the picture. Although blurry the front sight, gas cylinder and front of barrel of one seem to be barely discernible.
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  #13  
Old 12-11-2016, 08:46 PM
Rick the Librarian Rick the Librarian is offline
 
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Yes, there are a couple of Garands in the picture. I have other photos showing individual Garands captured by the Japanese in the Philippines.
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  #14  
Old 12-11-2016, 10:41 PM
S99VG S99VG is offline
 
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But I'm still left wondering where those 27,000 rifles came from in the February 1942 inventory. This was before we had any mass surrender of military personnel so it makes you wonder if they were captured in armories and arsonals. I've seen the pictures before and it has always been my hunch that they represent the arms that were left after the fall of Bataan in April 1942 and Corrigedor in May of 1942.
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  #15  
Old 12-12-2016, 12:07 AM
Rick the Librarian Rick the Librarian is offline
 
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The drives by the Japanese 14th Army, when it landed at Lingayen Gulf, drove back the largely Filipino force, causing many to flee without their weapons. A number of others were the result of battlefield pick-ups. Included in the total were 31 American tanks. This was the result of a bridge being blown before the Americans could cross. The tanks were not disabled, for the most part.

Here is the total report - it appeared in the official U.S. Army volume on the fall of the Philippines, so I feel it is accurate.

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  #16  
Old 12-12-2016, 09:19 AM
S99VG S99VG is offline
 
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Do you think the 27,000 rifles were battlefield captures from the initial Japanese invasion? If so then that would make them 1917s as it is my understanding that the Enfield was largely issued to the Filipino forces.
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  #17  
Old 12-12-2016, 09:25 AM
Rick the Librarian Rick the Librarian is offline
 
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Obviously, they were not "differentiated" in the table, but that is most likely. The vast number of soldiers at the start of war were Filipinos.

Here's a link to another film clip that shows some of the large amounts of weapons captured by the Japanese. The field guns are not "French 75s" but a 75mm U.S.-built version of the British 18 pounder used in WWI.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65...itary-cemetery
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  #18  
Old 12-12-2016, 08:00 PM
Calif-Steve Calif-Steve is offline
 
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The vast majority of capture rifles had to be M1917's. What happened to them is a mystery. I Japanese captured piles of British No.1's and actually issued them to front line troops. The fate of the M1917's remains a mystery.
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  #19  
Old 12-12-2016, 09:13 PM
Rick the Librarian Rick the Librarian is offline
 
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Again, large numbers were issued to puppet troops and even Japanese occupation troops. At least one pile of them got destroyed by American troops at or near the end of the war:

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  #20  
Old 12-12-2016, 09:39 PM
Rick the Librarian Rick the Librarian is offline
 
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Some other uses that captured U.S. rifles were put to:









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