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  #21  
Old 02-04-2018, 04:16 PM
lapriester lapriester is offline
 
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By the time you purchase the bulk reloading machinery that will eventually make it profitable, secure the licenses and insurance you need, pay for said insurance, you won't turn a profit for many years. If ever. Ammunition manufacturers, for the most part, also manufacture their own brass, bullets and often primers at prices no private person can possibly match when buying components. They also are usually part of big conglomerates and have almost unlimited resources to fall back on when times get tough or sales slump.

An example is one called Vista Outdoor. Within that conglomerate you'll find Blazer, Federal, Speer, CCI, Alliant, Estate, Independence, Fusion, American Eagle, RCBS. Tell me how you can compete with that? Google Vista Outdoor and you'll be shocked what they control. It's no wonder prices are so fixed on so many outdoor, hunting, shooting and recreation products. And you thought there were anti-trust laws protecting consumers. Think again.
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  #22  
Old 02-04-2018, 05:11 PM
jmm jmm is offline
 
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So much for all those folks who say there is nothing wrong with taking the pulled AP bullets and loading them in 7.62 rounds, huh?
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  #23  
Old 02-04-2018, 05:24 PM
Vos Parate Vos Parate is offline
 
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Wow, so much misinformation in one thread.
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  #24  
Old 02-05-2018, 10:08 AM
oldwxman oldwxman is offline
 
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Location: Ohio
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Let me see if I have this right. Ownership of AP bullets is OK as long as they are not reloaded into a cartridge that could be used in a handgun? 30-06 is OK but not 308/7.62.
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  #25  
Old 02-05-2018, 11:01 AM
Ohio Don Ohio Don is offline
 
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Location: S Florida and SE Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meplat View Post
Reading the actual complaint here

https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...ig-Charge.html

perhaps the press was right?

Perhaps the press and the Feds are wrong. 18 USC 921 (17)" (B) The term “armor piercing ammunition” means—
(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or
(ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile.
"
Note that it says a handgun. The ammo he bought was for a rifle.
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  #26  
Old 02-05-2018, 01:03 PM
Gewehr43 Gewehr43 is offline
 
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Location: Denver, CO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio Don View Post
Perhaps the press and the Feds are wrong. 18 USC 921 (17)" (B) The term “armor piercing ammunition” means—
(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or
(ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile.
"
Note that it says a handgun. The ammo he bought was for a rifle.
The problem is there are 308 pistols, making 308 ammunition fall under that clause you are quoting.............
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  #27  
Old 02-05-2018, 03:30 PM
Ohio Don Ohio Don is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gewehr43 View Post
The problem is there are 308 pistols, making 308 ammunition fall under that clause you are quoting.............
There are pistols in many sizes that would make all AP rounds illegal. But most .308 rounds are used in rifles, not pistols. .308 pistols are few and far between. Just like .30-06 pistols are few and far between. Think about it for a minute. Do you want your M2AP banned too? Neither .308 or .30-06 are considered pistol caliber rounds by most people.
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  #28  
Old 02-05-2018, 04:12 PM
Gewehr43 Gewehr43 is offline
 
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Ohio:
Theses laws aren't something I made up or support, I'm just explaining how this guy got in trouble.
Back when the first AR 308 pistol came out the manufacturer was warned about this effect and chose to do it anyway.
The same reason is why 762x39 AP got banned from sale, etc.
If a 30-06 pistol comes out and the ATF notices, yes, they wil make notice of it.

None of this is my doing, I'm just explaining it to you.
Don't like it......... Vote.
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Last edited by Gewehr43; 02-05-2018 at 04:18 PM.
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  #29  
Old 02-05-2018, 06:23 PM
6.5 Swedish 6.5 Swedish is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CadillacMike View Post
I think he already admitted to selling it.
Which is why you should NEVER talk to the cops.

Any time the cops show up at your door and start asking questions, you should have a rehearsed answer: "Officer, I choose to exercise my Fourth, Fifth and Sixth Amendment rights. Here is the number of my attorney (XXX) XXX-XXXX. Please leave my property immediately."

Cops love it when you open your mouth and indict yourself... when you do their job for them, it makes their $100k+ paycheck, bennies, and 20-and-out with a lifetime pension soooo much sweeter...

Last edited by 6.5 Swedish; 02-05-2018 at 06:26 PM.
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  #30  
Old 02-05-2018, 10:06 PM
gmerkt gmerkt is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Edmonds Washington
Posts: 275
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This is a story about how a person can get in legal trouble with a hobby. Firearms and ammunition are potentially lethal by their very nature so the risks are accordingly higher than say, collecting postage stamps or baseball cards. Discharging firearms and assembling/using self-made ammunition are two particularly dangerous practices in this hobby and demand full attention and exercise of caution. In all respects, including good judgement. Fair warning to all the beer-drinking fools firing blindly over hills.

I've been aware for many years that loading ammunition for sale without an FFL is a violation of law. Class 6 license, I think it is. Yet I've seen any number of people at gun shows over the years doing same. Some were clever enough not to put identifying information on the boxes. Yet not a good guarantee that a person can't be tracked down.

It's crazy to do this. As someone else already pointed out, there's no money to be made from it. Surely and purely not enough to be worth inviting unnecessary exposure to liability. If something goes wrong, you not only have potential legal consequences, but CIVIL LIABILITY. Which can be personally ruinous. Think of the estates of the dead and the many wounded survivors of the Las Vegas shooting, all potential civil litigants against this guy who made ammo in his garden shed in AZ.
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