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Old 01-12-2017, 08:13 AM
Pinecone Pinecone is offline
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 487


Actually testing against dry wall material, and other things.
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Old 01-20-2017, 11:26 PM
Ammolab Ammolab is offline
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 319

Originally Posted by itwillis View Post
Marketing hype and real world aren't the same thing. Hornady also uses several solid metal bullets in their barrier/TAP loads
I work and teach and train in this world. Your understanding of terminal effects of modern ammunition is flawed. I suggest you seek information from primary sources not on the internet.
Sorry but my info on "bonded" (NOT solid) bullets come from the mfg. and the info was intended for people who work in the real world. Many makers say they are designed "to penetrate barriers" and reach a protected target. This is what separates them from hunting or varmint type bullets. Why did we even need a "bonded" bullet when we had a plethora of fragile expanding bullets for decades?

If that is hype, I fell for it. If you say they blow up on impact and have limited penetration...well, use what ever you please.
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Old 01-21-2017, 12:53 PM
hunterX hunterX is offline
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: PA
Posts: 723

Maybe the other fella is referring to the ability of even bonded bullets to come apart if impact speed is higher due to range , etc than it was intended to stay together at.
besides we all know bonding is only a way to help keep the jacket connected to the core which is important in helping control what it was intended to do in the first place and other factors on construction come into play in what a bullet will do.
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Old 01-22-2017, 03:01 AM
itwillis itwillis is offline
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Le Mars, IA 51031
Posts: 580

Shoot what you want.
Here's all you need to know:

From the condition stated into a soft target as follows...

Scores listed as PASS or FAIL for soft target performance followed by lethality LOW MED HIGH (after hitting soft target)

OTM at close range = PASS/LOW
OTM through intermediate light barrier = FAIL/LOW

JSP through light barrier: FAIL/LOW

Solid Expanding at close range = PASS / HIGH
Solid Expanding through light barrier = 50/50 PASS FAIL (brand dependent) / HIGH

Bonded JSP (FBI not hunting) at close range = PASS / LOW
Bonded JSP through light barrier = PASS / MED

Not even going to waste time with M193/M855 it's all over the map and too highly dependent on impact velocity.

As to what you would use indoors or in urban or crowded environments the choice is pretty obvious when laid out in this manner.

As to Hornady, they make good stuff but as of today they still haven't proven themselves in the LE world. Their rifle ammo is at least better than their pistol ammo. I love them for match grade stuff, but so far they themselves are the only ones who have gotten their advertised results with their duty anmo, nobody else can seem to get it to work like they do.
itwillis Feedback thread located here:


Last edited by itwillis; 01-22-2017 at 03:27 AM.
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Old 01-23-2017, 11:07 AM
hunterX hunterX is offline
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: PA
Posts: 723

And there it is ....... "All you really need to know" but were too afraid to ask.....
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Old 01-29-2017, 07:52 PM
astra600 astra600 is offline
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 65

Back to m1 carbine ammo for a moment. Hornady has a Critical Defense load that they say shoots 2000 fps from an 18" carbine barrel. 110gr FTX bullet. Tests on other carbine bullets show an average speed of 1850 fps, even though all the boxes say 1990 fps. These have been on youtube. This isn't to say all carbine ammo is under powered, but some are, chrono'd and filmed. Gold dot has a well earned reputation. Lead soft points jam my carbine.
Back to you, Chet.
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Old 01-31-2017, 01:04 PM
gwfrench gwfrench is offline
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Frederick, MD
Posts: 95

Last summer I tested Aguila 30 Carbine ammo. rated speed 1990 feet/second
My test average 1994 feet/second for 10 rounds
Low 1954, high 2021
From my Inland WW2 carbine.
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Old 02-08-2017, 02:49 PM
colomountain colomountain is offline
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Divide, CO
Posts: 90

For what its worth, I had an interesting experience with 168 gr. 308 Win Gold Medal Match ammo. When at the range I observed a round that disintegrated ( it left a brass colored ring with a sunburst effect on a building board backer. The guy to my right was shooing 168 gr. A-Max which, while not as accurate at 200+ yards, penetrated well.

My Department's standard issue long range ammo was the Gold Medal. We changed that after talking to others with similar experiences with the 168 grain Sierra MatchKing bullets. Granted, it was "only" one of over a hundred rounds I fired that day. Food for thought if you're talking penetration. My recommendation is to test any ammo yourself against barriers because so many factors affect performance. We also shot glass barriers (front windshields) in front of a silhouette. It was a revelation.

Last edited by colomountain; 02-08-2017 at 02:59 PM.
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Old 02-08-2017, 06:15 PM
Ammolab Ammolab is offline
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 319

Look here for a deal on 64gr bonded solid base 5.56 ammo by Nosler.

$17/box and free shipping on a $100 order. Also discount for Vets, GIs, and LE

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