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-   -   M1903 A3 Drill Rifles @ South Store. (http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=275256)

rubicon762 01-19-2021 01:12 PM

M1903 A3 Drill Rifles @ South Store.
 
Hi
I drove down to TMP from Ohio on 01/15/2021 for the Talladega 600 match
and had a great time. :)

My first stop was the CMP South Store. I saw a lot of nice rifles, but I was looking for M1903 A3 Drill Rifles, which they had 6! They looked nice too.

Then I looked at the price: $350. :eek:

I know "prices go up" on just about everything. But that's a 133% price increase over 2 years ago when I last bought one at the CMP Eastern Games for $150.

I used to like to buy one of these to cherry pick for a "better" stock, or metal parts. I even re-activated a Drill Rifle, which I use in competition because of the 0/0 Criterion barrel I had installed.

I have the money. But, I just can't justify $350 for a M1903 A3 Drill Rifle, when for only $300 more, I can buy an active, shoot-able one.
Which I also have in the past.:)

As this is the Feedback Forum, I think you want to hear customer opinions/feedback.

Thank you.

smag 01-20-2021 08:28 AM

Same thing I told Bobby Face to face at CMP in Dec. Dec 4th to be exact. He said management raised price then in same exchange admitted he had changed the pricing of Drills.

When CMP sells them to Scrappers on the cheap and then scrappers sell the stocks (just the stocks) for 6 times more than what they paid for the entire rifle you would want to do something too? but, that is not the individual CMP customers fault.

So, a person says " I know, lets just raise price here in store to make up for bad decisions".

He was so offended when I asked about the huge price increase. It was clear he had made the price change and took it personal. He actually told me to bring it up on forums if I did not like it. Glad you did because they woulda kicked me off here.

I was lucky I usually bought 4-5 drills a trip. They would bring em out in a shopping cart in old days. They wanted them gone. No limit!

Its a purty chitty deal but price has not changed. It their Cat and they can skin it anyway they want I reckon.

I did get a drill for $350.00 that day. It had a rod pushed in chamber and was not welded. Pushed it out, got a shooter 1903a3 for $350.00.

Shawn~

broomhandle 01-20-2021 05:11 PM

Hi rubicon762 & smag,

I totally understand this drill rifle problem. I bought more then one! Honestly many of us think $350 is a lot of cash for a wall hanger.
Has anyone pointed out to people in power, that we can get a drill rifle from a few other sources at a better price?
I'm sure most of us would rather buy from the CMP DIRECTLY.

We CAN buy a NEW complete & functional rifle for just a few dollars more! :cool:

Since the new management team came in, things have changed some for the better, some people feel, not so much.
We have to understand what the CMP's management thought process for the next few years is.
I would like to think the CMP wants happy shooters & repeat customers, as they did in the past! More then one company has shrunk or gone bankrupt with bad business moves Sears, A&P, Oldsmobile , DeSOTO. Montgomery Ward & American Motors to name a few!

It has to cost a small fortune to maintain the CMP marksmanship range & even with volunteer help. The CMP games around the country cost money, even with the great support from the local volunteers.

WE miss not being able to get a nice breakfast or lunch indoors at Camp Perry. If WE don't get up early to cook for ourselves, the usually cold breakfast or lunch off the one or two food trucks is poor at best.
There is no joy at 0 DARK THIRTY looking for a open diner in the closest town. I'm sure it would be well supported, IF it was reinstituted.

Hoping for a BETTER year on all fronts,
broom

ZvenoMan 01-20-2021 06:21 PM

I post this will all due respect;
I am a drill rifle fan, and will continue to seek them out.
We have no knowledge of, nor need to know the details behind the management decisions of any company we do not own, including the CMP.
The CMP charter requires them to sell items at fair market value, and I suspect we all know CMP's items are universally bargains.
Drill rifles are an insignificant portion of their sales, and and even more insignificant portion of their overall operations.
Like any company we are free to buy their products or not.
CMP raises the prices on every item they sell when needed, and we simply don't need to know the details behind that.
I assure you if the drill rifles do not sell at the current prices, and CMP determines they have more than they "need" (not sure why they would need any), the prices will drop. Remember the crate auctions (Dupage remembers them). Storing rifles is an expense; no retailer wants to store product.

In the past year or three at the south store I have noticed the drill rifles had varying prices, based on condition and value. I have paid a low of $125 (from Smag's shopping cart!) up to something over $200 for the ones I have purchased. I recall seeing some priced more, they simply didn't meet my needs.

The $125 example will still in no way be worth more than the parts I have in it (and using $0.00 for the labor), that is not why anyone buys them (excluding wholesalers of course). Maybe in 20 years? I am in no way counting on that.

Perhaps the only drills available currently are the $350.00 specimens, or did I miss a memo that all CMP drill 1903s are now $350? My experience is some days they have none, some a few that I don't want, and some days the shopping carts are out with prices all over.

I am comfortable allowing CMP to manage the basic economics of running such a business based on my knowledge of retail and business economics and my observations over the years as their customer. Not every items they sell, that I want is priced where I "feel" it should be for me; I know few businesses that do.

Complaining about management or drill rifle prices may not achieve the outcome desired.
Note that CMP is working like mad simply to keep up with demand on the M1 sales alone; how far behind are they now?
Maybe let the drill rifles collect some dust and buy from Dupage? Of course looking at their website today their prices are not much different and the selection is pretty weak. There is always tomorrow, bot at Dupage as well as the south store.

Respectfully;
JH

smag 01-20-2021 07:06 PM

Well said

But.... the price jump just does not make or follow pricing of increases say or 1903a3’s.
In 2013 i purchased some for 600.00 mail order.

7 yrs later there what? $150.00 more.

Just an observation.

Where do you think Dupage is getting Drills?

Shawn

ZvenoMan 01-20-2021 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smag (Post 2006476)
Well said

But.... the price jump just does not make or follow pricing of increases say or 1903a3ís.
In 2013 i purchased some for 600.00 mail order.

7 yrs later there what? $150.00 more.

Just an observation.

Where do you think Dupage is getting Drills?

Shawn

I don't know where the ones Dupage has listed now came from, I do recall hearing they acquired some from CMP in the past. But it has no bearing on anything I mentioned. At the end of the day, who cares where they got them?
Drill rifles are not shootable so CMPs 1903 or Garand prices and/or increases don't apply to this discussion.
While I still suggest as CMP customers we have no need to know how and why CMP price increases are made, looking at the Dupage website show's CMP's drill rifle prices are in no way out of line with "current market value". Not that Dupage's prices reflect the definition of market value but these certainly are a limited product.

Now I am curious: Are all CMP drill 1903s $350 now (as per an announcement from CMP) or is this simply a reaction to the fact that on some visits by a few CMP customers only $350 examples were available? I can tell you when I found the $125 drill I was surprised as I'd never seen one that low, but it was a low number 1903 and missing a few parts so I wasn't surprised.

JH

smag 01-21-2021 09:00 AM

Sure who wants a low number that's good for making a 22lr is all.

You read the PH68 report ZV.


Wonder where are all those drill M1's? I was in VFW this fall that wanted to get rid of all their cerimony m1's. I know those are getting turned in back to GVT. In fact i told them to contact CMP or AAD.

Just imagine if everything in house tripled in 3yrs? How do you reach the regular folks that your charter is all about? Just an observation

ZvenoMan 01-21-2021 04:12 PM

I remember when they used to sell the drill M1s in the stores, I thought of getting one as a wall hanger/keep Zvenoson occupied. Haven't seen them in yours, I just assumed they don't sell them anymore but supply to the veterans organizations or JROTC, whoever uses them? Never cared to look into it.
Yeah, I keep up with PH68, just hadn't heard of an announcement that al 1903 drills are $350; again I just assumed that the only ones currently available were "nicer".

What do you mean by reaching the regular folk if everything tripled?
I expect CMP assumes that those who want a CMP rifle will take the time to go to CMP.com and read the "jumping through hoops" process and do that. It's discussed at CMP, and related events as well. Prices always rise, on everything so were I CMP I wouldn't make any special effort. Orest used to say buy it now if you want it, if I recall.

JH

JustinandKim 01-21-2021 06:57 PM

I think a lot of those old M1 drill rifles went into making statues for Talladega Marksmanship Park and in front of the South Store facility.

moose 01-21-2021 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZvenoMan (Post 2006775)
I remember when they used to sell the drill M1s in the stores, I thought of getting one as a wall hanger/keep Zvenoson occupied. Haven't seen them in yours, I just assumed they don't sell them anymore but supply to the veterans organizations or JROTC, whoever uses them? Never cared to look into it.
Yeah, I keep up with PH68, just hadn't heard of an announcement that al 1903 drills are $350; again I just assumed that the only ones currently available were "nicer".


JH

Wasn't that long ago. The North store was blessed, or cursed... with racks upon racks of the most beat to death M1 Drill Rifles.

With suposedly an epic amount of drill rifles in storage.
https://forums.thecmp.org/showthread...=223046&page=3

The drill rifles began to be a serious sore point with us North Store shoppers (along with a lot of snipers). It was sadly not uncommon to go to the store and only find snipers and drills..

When the newest CMP north store opened, none of the drills ever reappeared.

While beat, the wood on them was pretty serviceable. So I theorize that the drills were pulled back into the armory and the stocks salvaged to help ease the wood shortage that started with the Turks, and got worse with the Philippines returns... what they did with the rest. Who knows. (other then the statue of course)

ZvenoMan 01-21-2021 07:56 PM

I bought my share of them, because I needed some more projects (extreme sarcasm). I need no more. If there are any in the SS my next visit I am sure I will pick through them, and one or two may follow me home.
Here are some of mine:

https://forums.thecmp.org/showthread...=158125&page=6
https://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=226660
https://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=231527

I don't have a thread on my LN 1903 I got, maybe someday. Same day I get back to work on these.

JH

smag 01-22-2021 08:12 AM

At $350 unless its got a nice $350 stock its not worth the time. I got a bunch still in my pile at $100.
Have an a4 ready to go soon. Maybe I sell it ready to go but let a CMP member build it up. Just lay out all the parts and have it parked and D & T. With a a4 C stock and Smag bolt.

A4 Drill in a box, so to speak.

Smag~

rubicon762 01-22-2021 10:05 AM

On my recent visit to the CMP South Store, if the price had been (the former) $150, I would have definitely bought two.

Possibly three.

C Dexter 01-23-2021 06:06 PM

I have also bought many drill rifles in the past at $150 and $175. At $350, it is not worth it anymore. They would have to have something really special about them to make them worth $350. I have to agree, a $50 raise in price would have been reasonable. Doubling or more the price is way past reasonable. They are going to run away the collectors and people that like to restore these rifles (like me). I really hope they come to their senses and bring the prices back to something reasonable. But if some people are willing to pay those prices, I can't blame the CMP for getting all they can get. They won't be getting it from me though.

ZvenoMan 01-23-2021 06:39 PM

Maybe the current drill rifles are worth $350 (because of some feature or condition) and they simply haven't processed any at a lower grade recently?
No one has described these offensive rifles so far.

M1C Rack Grades are not flying off the shelves, and I recall collector and special grades collecting dust years ago.
If the lines weren't so long at the SS (and the 1.25 hr each way drive) I'd inspect and report on them myself just to lower the blood pressure of a few.
Not everything is a conspiracy.....

JH

smag 01-23-2021 08:35 PM

I will tell ya. Some are hit hard, some are not to bad. The other thing is they are only letting you take one. So, at $350 a pop and you get only one. Hardly worth a 20 min drive. Unless you find one that had an under achiever Wage Grade welder who did the demill.

Unless you just want wall hanger ya got to go thru a few to find a good one for building a shooter.

Smag~

navyrifleman 01-26-2021 08:43 PM

The 2002 CMP catalog lists complete 03A3 drill rifles with walnut stocks for $100. Drill rifles with plastic stocks or missing parts went for $50.

horsesoldier03 01-27-2021 08:42 PM

I just placed my first order for a M1 SPECIAL RACK Grade. At $650, I honestly think it is a decent price. However, $350 sounds extremely high on a 1903 DRILL Grade. I do understand their frustration because you do see a lot of CMP Rifles posted on Gunbroker that are significantly higher than they are sold through CMP. IMO, I think one of the reasons people are more willing to pay a higher price on gunbroker is because you SEE what you are getting. There is no mystery of what or WHEN you will get it. It has been a month, and I havent even receive an email acknowledging my order.

captaincalc 02-07-2021 06:30 PM

Supply and demand. How many driller 03's are left in the CMP empire? How many are left "out there" in the drilling world? Not many, I'd bet. they've been selling LOTS of them for a long time. And the question becomes: if the drillers are too much then why not get a regular shooter? Sounds like a number of you would prefer the shooter. So get one and skip the second rate "gun." Maybe we should suggest they stick the drill 03's on the auction site...

hebes405 02-08-2021 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captaincalc (Post 2013202)
Supply and demand. How many driller 03's are left in the CMP empire? How many are left "out there" in the drilling world? Not many, I'd bet. they've been selling LOTS of them for a long time. And the question becomes: if the drillers are too much then why not get a regular shooter? Sounds like a number of you would prefer the shooter. So get one and skip the second rate "gun." Maybe we should suggest they stick the drill 03's on the auction site...

With a price that high, they pretty much killed all the demand...they should raise the price of M1s. If its about supply/demand.

They will never lower the price. When is the last time they listened to customers / competitors? Nobody wanted the saftey glasses rule, yet, its still in the books. They are going to do what they want to.

ceresco 02-09-2021 10:20 AM

I am firmly in the camp that allows individuals to do as they choose. The only principle that the eye (ear) protection issue brings up is "public burden" ie: the public should not be burdened by an individual's irresponsible act. This is real in the area of seat belts and motorcycle helmets due to the astronomical costs associated with brain and spinal injuries. It is not real in the area of statistically insignificant eye injuries possibly occurring at CMP events. I suspect this is the same old "our lawyers said" argument which seems to affect many of the things we do. I do wonder what would happen if, as the targets come up at CP, everyone held their classes up and no one fired a shot..... Good Shooting. ... BTW--if this rule change is "good", just what has been so "bad" for the last hundred years?? Must be we are "woke" now....

smag 02-09-2021 04:02 PM

Eye Pro is standard in every US Armed Force now and has been fo quite some time. Not gettin around that. NO PPE and yer gonna pay the price.

Back to drills , $200.00 in AZ, wood for drills and they still beat the price. My last one came with a CMP tag still on it.

Smag~

AZ ED 04-18-2021 07:48 PM

Thank GOD we have a second choice, Dupage trading. Jim has been in the business a long time. He is a old fart like me (hope he doesn't read this) AZ ED out.

insulator-king 04-21-2021 06:41 PM

From Dupage;

SMITH CORONA 1903A3 DRILL RIFLE

$300.00

Out of stock


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