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  #1  
Old 05-21-2015, 07:46 PM
warder warder is offline
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Clarksville, TN
Posts: 349
Default "Big Red" stocks

Can a stock be a big red and not have either Winchester or Sykes marking under the butt plate?
I have a couple that have all of the fatter areas but no markings in the butt area.
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  #2  
Old 05-22-2015, 04:26 AM
nf1e nf1e is offline
 
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Location: Connecticut
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This was a Big Red from Fred's a few years ago. Has no markings under the butt plate. It makes a nice home for a James River Armory M21 DMR.

http://
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  #3  
Old 05-23-2015, 11:33 PM
Rock Rock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nf1e View Post
This was a Big Red from Fred's a few years ago. Has no markings under the butt plate. It makes a nice home for a James River Armory M21 DMR.

http://
I don't know much about them but I always thought that the Big Red stocks were birch. It looks like you have a very nice walnut stock there. I'm also trying to see the 'Big' areas of that stock. It looks pretty much like the regular gov't issue M14 stocks that I have.
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Old 05-24-2015, 04:41 AM
nf1e nf1e is offline
 
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Fred's lists Big Red stock in either birch or walnut. Not cheap, but they are heavier than standard.
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  #5  
Old 05-24-2015, 04:17 PM
Renisin Renisin is offline
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I have a "BIG RED", and it is stamped SA. in the butt stock and is walnut.
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  #6  
Old 05-26-2015, 10:14 PM
tmilliron tmilliron is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Norman Oklahoma
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Sometimes on Walnut especially a DOD cartouche (very small cartouche and hard to see in the V) on the trigger guard recess - Winchester-WesternManufacturer Identification

The manufacturer identification, if present, is located on the butt end under the butt plate.

H - Harrington & Richardson Arms Co. (Worcester, MA)
O - S . E. Overton Co. (South Haven, MI)(made stocks for TRW)
SA or S.A. - Springfield Armory (Springfield, MA)
S under a half-diamond - H. Sacks & Sons, Inc. (Brookline, MA) (subcontractor to Springfield Armory)
W-W - Winchester-Western (New Haven, CT)

Wood Type

M14 rifles were assembled with wood stocks from the first half of 1961 until July 1963. All four government entities used wood stocks during this two year period for factory assembly of complete rifles.

Black Walnut - H. Sacks & Sons, Inc., Harrington & Richardson Arms Co., S. E. Overton Co., Springfield Armory, and Winchester-Western

Yellow Birch - H. Sacks & Sons, Inc., Harrington & Richardson Arms Co., S. E. Overton Co., and Winchester-Western

Some walnut and birch stocks were stamped on the butt with numerals, e.g., 1 or 3. Springfield Armory and Harrington & Richardson Arms did so. H. Sacks & Sons, Inc. stocks were made as replacement parts, both standard rack grade and National Match stocks. Some H. Sacks & Sons, Inc. M14 NM stocks have the part number 7791174 stamped into the wood under the butt plate. H. Sacks & Sons, Inc. and Winchester-Western "big red" birch stocks were often stamped with the part number 11010263 under the butt plate.

Stock Ferrules

Stock ferrules were staked to the front end of the wood stock using either a pin punch (ice pick / dimple appearance) or a half-moon crimp (gorilla thumbnail appearance). The pin punch method of staking was used throughout government production of the M14 and M14 NM rifles. I have a Springfield Armory M14 NM walnut stock with a pin punch staked ferrule. IMO, it's not accurate to say the pin punch ferrules were only used early in the M14 project. The half-moon crimped stock ferrules do seem to be more common.

Pin punch staked ferrules - H. Sacks & Sons, Inc., Harrington & Richardson Arms Co., S. E. Overton Co., Springfield Armory, and Winchester-Western

Half-moon crimped ferrules - H. Sacks & Sons, Inc., Springfield Armory, and Winchester-Western

Proof P and DAS Markings

Proof P markings on M14 stocks have been observed in two styles, serif font and Arial style. Harrington & Richardson Arms Co. used the Arial style proof marking. Springfield Armory, TRW and Winchester used both serif and Arial P proof stamps on completed rifles.

DOD cartouche on side of the buttstock or on the trigger guard recess - Winchester-Western

DOD cartouche and proof P markings both visible on the stock - indicates a stock used to assemble a M14 rifle at the factory: Harrington & Richardson Arms Co., Springfield Armory, TRW and Winchester-Western (Olin Mathieson Chemical Corp.) M14 NM rifles built by Springfield Armory and TRW were also given both markings on the stock.

Most replacement stocks lack the proof P and DOD cartouches. If Springfield Armory shipped a replacement stock (made by H. Sacks & Sons, Inc.), it left with a DOD cartouche. A proof P inside a square marking means the rifle was rebuilt at an arsenal or depot and proof fired.
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