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  #21  
Old 06-22-2021, 05:14 PM
6.5x68 6.5x68 is offline
 
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Location: PA
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It was never meant to be tricky or difficult to figure out. It's only as confusing as someone cares to make it. It's simple to me, post eleven shared his feelings on the matter with a disclaimer of respecting others opinons. Post 12 chose not to respect the opinions of others.
I highly doubt that anyone will be disrespectful to the rules set in place by the CMP, so ultimately it will be what it will be.
For those of us being told obsessively to mask up and follow safety theater, it's getting boring. Unless your wearing a n95, it's really not going to matter what side of the mask your on. If your afraid of a person not wearing a mask even though you are, your common sense is trying to tell you it's not working.
I'm sorry, I know this aggravates alot of people, but that's how I feel. Cleanliness and distance, that's common sense too and works well. Wearing a piece of cloth on your face.... Yeah makes everyone feel safer and gains you access to the store, that's about it.
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  #22  
Old 06-22-2021, 06:39 PM
mnhusker mnhusker is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,510
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No mask, not even the vaunted N95 mask can prevent penetration by viruses.

All the masks due is reduce droplet propagation (sputum) which contains virus or bacteria, but the virus can spread through the air without being in droplets.

So the only successful function of masks is if you are ill with Covid, it reduces, not stops the virus that is exhaled when you breathe out be decreasing the droplets that you expel.

Ideally people ill with Covid would be at home, not out in public!

If you want to avoid airborne Covid, one would need a MOPP level IV biohazard suit or the equivalent self-contained suit worn in a Level 4 Biohazard lab, nothing else would work.

Studies have shown that airborne droplet transmission can be 10-12 feet so that if an unmasked ill Covid patient coughs, "six feet social distancing" is not going to do anything. On the other hand even a Covid test positive person who is not ill, is not at risk to transmit the disease unless they bleed profusely on you.


The only part of the pandemic that has been of use is a refreshing look at cleanliness. Washing hands, washing anything more often than we used to is very important to combat any and ill infectious diseases and will improve the populations general health.

All the best and good shooting, even to ceresco who wishes me harm.

PS: "proof" masks don't work, look at all the people who wear glasses, like me, whoses glasses fog over. That's from air escaping around the mask........

Last edited by mnhusker; 06-22-2021 at 06:42 PM.
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  #23  
Old 06-22-2021, 08:41 PM
AWOhio AWOhio is offline
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Columbus OH
Posts: 456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6.5x68 View Post
It was never meant to be tricky or difficult to figure out. It's only as confusing as someone cares to make it. It's simple to me, post eleven shared his feelings on the matter with a disclaimer of respecting others opinons. Post 12 chose not to respect the opinions of others.
I highly doubt that anyone will be disrespectful to the rules set in place by the CMP, so ultimately it will be what it will be.
For those of us being told obsessively to mask up and follow safety theater, it's getting boring. Unless your wearing a n95, it's really not going to matter what side of the mask your on. If your afraid of a person not wearing a mask even though you are, your common sense is trying to tell you it's not working.
I'm sorry, I know this aggravates alot of people, but that's how I feel. Cleanliness and distance, that's common sense too and works well. Wearing a piece of cloth on your face.... Yeah makes everyone feel safer and gains you access to the store, that's about it.
I wrote post 12, I don't feel it was disrespectful... I simply asked if the OP was going to follow CDC and State of Ohio recommendations. Those recommendations don't require a mask, or vaccination. But they sure do recommend that if you don't do one, you at least do the other when indoors. A fleeting visit to the store or a shop in vendor row may not be much of an issue. But spending 8 - 10 hours a day in an enclosed space in the barracks with 40 other people sure should require pre-event testing, and masks while indoors.

We have all been around shooting ranges enough to know that some people are of the opinion that it doesn't matter if they point their rifles at other shooters when "they know it isn't loaded". Is it disrespecting their opinions to tell them to keep it pointed downrange, and put a chamber flag in it?

Is it disrespecting your chef's opinion to require that he washes his hands after using the bathroom before returning to the kitchen?

Is it disrespecting a doctor or nurse to require that they are masked up in the operating room?

If one finds that masks are boring (and I agree), there is a simple 1 or 2 step process that makes it unnecessary. The vaccine is free, has been under development and testing for 18 months, and between the 3 versions in use in the US, have been tested on about 200 million people in the US alone by now.
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  #24  
Old 06-22-2021, 09:28 PM
6.5x68 6.5x68 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: PA
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I must admit a tendency to be wrong, but "are you going to impose your health decisions on others" is slightly disrespectful.
Everyone attending knows what they are getting into. As long as all participants follow CMP house rules which I'm sure will be the state's also, no one needs to be shamed for living the way they feel fit.
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  #25  
Old 06-22-2021, 09:40 PM
MarkV MarkV is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Port Clinton Ohio
Posts: 504
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No current legal requirements, fines, nights in the Gulag, etc. for not wearing masks in Ohio. Everyones personal choice, everyone’s personal decision.
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  #26  
Old 06-23-2021, 10:47 AM
rubicon762 rubicon762 is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Greater Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AWOhio View Post
As an unvaccinated individual, will you be following CDC and State of Ohio guidelines and wearing a mask while in-doors in shared housing in the barracks, or are you imposing your personal health choice on other people?
You sound afraid. I don't think you should be.
Covid-19 really is not that dangerous. It has a 99.5% survival rate in my age group.

I reject your disrespectful question.

Here are some facts to consider:

You got the Covid vaccination, but you CAN still get Covid!

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ry/ar-BB1fHoY7

Latest VAERS Data Show: 5,165 Deaths Reported Following COVID Vaccines

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/d...ovid-vaccines/

On a personal note: My 30 something daughter got sick, tested positive for Covid-19. Sick for two days. She said "I've had worse Colds and Flu's."

Co-worker next to me (2 feet away) in my factory locker room had "scratchy throat". Tested positive for Covid-19( August of 2020), got 2 weeks off/PAID. Told me via phone he felt fine the next day, did a lot of fishing on Lake Erie.

See you on the Firing Line.
__________________
"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun... Let your gun, therefore, be the constant companion of your walks." Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785.

Read "War is a Racket" by MG Smedly Butler,USMC. He knew war,and was awarded the Medal of Honor twice. You can find it online.

Last edited by rubicon762; 06-23-2021 at 10:51 AM.
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  #27  
Old 06-23-2021, 10:18 PM
AWOhio AWOhio is offline
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Columbus OH
Posts: 456
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I still don't consider that my question disrespectful. Your vaccination is your choice, and if you aren't worried about the odds for yourself, you are right, that is your choice. But choosing to stay in communal housing while unvaccinated, without indicating that you intend to get tested prior to doing so, and while stating that you don't plan on wearing a mask IS inflicting your personal choice on others.

I don't mind seeing you on the firing line. Outdoor spread is unlikely, especially to those who are vaccinated.

But as one of your links does say, vaccinated individuals can still contract COVID. And as the link also states, vaccinated individuals can reduce risk by wearing masks when indoors around unvaccinated individuals. I'm not intending to stay in the barracks, so I'm not worried about it.

Following a link from your your Defender link, I see that the deaths data in VAARS counted deaths "from any cause" following vaccination. Following a link from your Defender page, you can page through the medical reports of each of those deaths, and they include things like someone with pre-existing kidney failure who refused dialysis. And the the average age of those who died "of any cause" following the vaccine is 74. Keep in mind, life expectancy in the US is 78, so that number of deaths "from any cause" is not surprising. https://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/fi...OW=0&V2OHIGH=2

But for the sake of argument, if we count all 5156 as vaccine related deaths, lets compare that to COVID.

5165 deaths following approximately 300,000,000 vaccinations. 17 deaths "from any cause" per million.

Vs 618,000 deaths following 34,449,000 cases of COVID in the US. 17,940 deaths from COVID per million.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rubicon762 View Post
You sound afraid. I don't think you should be.
Covid-19 really is not that dangerous. It has a 99.5% survival rate in my age group.

I reject your disrespectful question.

Here are some facts to consider:

You got the Covid vaccination, but you CAN still get Covid!

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...ry/ar-BB1fHoY7

Latest VAERS Data Show: 5,165 Deaths Reported Following COVID Vaccines

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/d...ovid-vaccines/

On a personal note: My 30 something daughter got sick, tested positive for Covid-19. Sick for two days. She said "I've had worse Colds and Flu's."

Co-worker next to me (2 feet away) in my factory locker room had "scratchy throat". Tested positive for Covid-19( August of 2020), got 2 weeks off/PAID. Told me via phone he felt fine the next day, did a lot of fishing on Lake Erie.

See you on the Firing Line.
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  #28  
Old 06-24-2021, 08:28 AM
okc Bob okc Bob is online now
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: OKC
Posts: 609
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It’s amazing to see people making medical decisions based on politics. I think it’s prudent to speak with your personal physician prior to making health care decisions regarding vaccination. The vaccine is safe & effective, but it’s not for everyone. So get advice from a professional instead from the internet or laypeople. Then decide if you want it. The 99% survival rate is a red herring. Survival is not the same as perfectly healthy. Some survivors have lung transplants & thousands are discharged home from the hospital on oxygen. Try living like that. I work in the ICU & watched scores of people die. Many under 50 with no comorbidities. Saw a few grieving family members tell me the patient refused the vaccine because he didn’t trust the gov’t. So, get the vaccine or don’t get it. It’s your free choice. Figure it out. Nobody cares either way. Good shooting everyone

Last edited by okc Bob; 06-24-2021 at 08:39 AM.
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  #29  
Old 06-24-2021, 09:18 AM
6.5x68 6.5x68 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: PA
Posts: 119
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"Nobody cares either way"
That's far from true. This thread is proof of that. I've made my decisions and they've got me and my family this far, my first shot is scheduled for Monday. I've taken my time, watched and read. Decided on the Pfizer shot.
What the people around me do or not do is their choice regardless of their motivation. After vaccinated, I have no plans bother anyone with my opinion, tell them how smart I am or to put a mask on.
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