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  #21  
Old 08-02-2021, 12:57 AM
Fenris_Bane Fenris_Bane is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Diamondback View Post
Pretty much any modern Jacketed Hollowpoint is usually good enough on terminal ballistics; a trainer I highly respect usually recommends "find out what your local PD issues and carry that."

Nobody WANTS to "kill somebody" here, the goal is to stop a deadly-force attacker before they can do harm to us or our loved ones.
That is kind of "splitting hairs". Hollow points are chosen for the greater wound cavity they create making a killing shot easier. They are also chosen because in certain cases, the have less penetration on certain forms of construction making over penetration less likely.

Don't kid yourself. Hollow points are designed to kill there by stopping a "deadly-force attacker" by killing them before they can kill you.

If you don't want to "kill somebody" then don't choose a firearm.

Safety rule I learned in the army ....

Never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to destroy or kill.

Last edited by Fenris_Bane; 08-02-2021 at 01:00 AM.
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  #22  
Old 08-02-2021, 11:52 AM
moose moose is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Indianapolis
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Originally Posted by Fenris_Bane View Post

Safety rule I learned in the army ....
Never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to destroy or kill.
Never bad advice..

However, honestly.. there is a school of thought that you shouldn't everyday carry a firearm that you don't want to loose to the local PD property room.

Will a USGI 1911 work for self defense? Yes.. Will that 1911 when used in a legit self defense shooting end up in the PD Property room, Your damn right it will.

I have a couple carry guns, all them were in the 200 to 300 dollar range. And yes you can get a dead nuts reliable firearm for that price. And I wont give a dang if for whatever reason, it ends up in the PD property room.
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  #23  
Old 08-02-2021, 12:37 PM
junnie junnie is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 168
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Originally Posted by moose View Post
Never bad advice..

However, honestly.. there is a school of thought that you shouldn't everyday carry a firearm that you don't want to loose to the local PD property room.

I have a couple carry guns, all them were in the 200 to 300 dollar range. And yes you can get a dead nuts reliable firearm for that price. And I wont give a dang if for whatever reason, it ends up in the PD property room.
Ditto: I carry a Bull Dog, 44 special, don't use a holster, small enough to fit in my pant pocket... sometimes a Glock 19.

Former USMC, 5th Marines Nam, 66-67

Pistols were very difficult to come by, fortunately my Lieutenant let me use his ,, had and real nice WW11 shoulder holster set up, fit me perfectly. He was same size as me, sometimes would wear his field jacket by mistake, couldn't figure out why everyone was saluting me at bridge crossings etc. Scared the ******** out me ,,, last thing I needed was getting burnt for impersonating a Officer... Although I was Officer material... LOL>>>>.. danke: Junnie
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  #24  
Old 08-02-2021, 02:33 PM
Diamondback Diamondback is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: Seattle area
Posts: 36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose View Post
Never bad advice..

However, honestly.. there is a school of thought that you shouldn't everyday carry a firearm that you don't want to loose to the local PD property room.

Will a USGI 1911 work for self defense? Yes.. Will that 1911 when used in a legit self defense shooting end up in the PD Property room, Your damn right it will.

I have a couple carry guns, all them were in the 200 to 300 dollar range. And yes you can get a dead nuts reliable firearm for that price. And I wont give a dang if for whatever reason, it ends up in the PD property room.
Bear in mind, any self-defense incident WILL have an Ambulance Chaser attached, and every word you say can be dragged up in court and used against you indicating mindset. "So you declared that you carried a gun because you MEANT to kill somebody and didn't care who!" is how the politically-motivated prosecutor or avaricious Wrongful Death civil litigant will present it.

Compare these two statements, and think about how each sounds if you're a juror.

1. "Don't carry unless you intend to draw. Don't draw unless you intend to shoot. Don't shoot unless you intend to kill."

2. "Don't carry unless you are prepared to draw. Don't draw unless you are prepared to shoot. Don't shoot unless you are prepared to kill in response to an imminent Deadly Force threat brought against yourself or another."

Which would play better to your ears if you're on the jury facing a man on trial for his life and/or livelihood and having to examine his state of mind at the moment of shooting?

The difference between passively being prepared to do something if your hand is forced, vs. what could be spun as actively going out looking for trouble. As I like to point out, "if Joe Violent-Crim Scumbag is so obliging as to put 'Gunfight, 3PM, NW part of town' in my appointment book, then starting from 2:30PM I'm going to be headed as far toward the southeast part of town as I can haul my fat fundament."

Save the good USGI or bespoke custom for nightstand or last line of defense; have a local gunsmith you trust tune up a $500 Armscor or similar for EDC. While my old warhorse is an Essex parts-bin mixmaster that's probably worth only its value in components parts as a part-out, I'm teeing up to retire it from duty and replace with more expendable because it's all I have to remember both a young lady I cared for enough to offer to trade my life for hers, and a long-gone old friend who mentored me on the 1911 platform, by.
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  #25  
Old 08-02-2021, 08:28 PM
Fenris_Bane Fenris_Bane is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamondback View Post
Bear in mind, any self-defense incident WILL have an Ambulance Chaser attached, and every word you say can be dragged up in court and used against you indicating mindset. "So you declared that you carried a gun because you MEANT to kill somebody and didn't care who!" is how the politically-motivated prosecutor or avaricious Wrongful Death civil litigant will present it.

Compare these two statements, and think about how each sounds if you're a juror.

1. "Don't carry unless you intend to draw. Don't draw unless you intend to shoot. Don't shoot unless you intend to kill."

2. "Don't carry unless you are prepared to draw. Don't draw unless you are prepared to shoot. Don't shoot unless you are prepared to kill in response to an imminent Deadly Force threat brought against yourself or another."
The lawyer that says #1 would also say you used hollow point because you intended to murder the victim by using exceptionally deadly ammunition.

They say anything to make is sound worse (or better) than the facts indicate it really is.
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