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  #111  
Old 11-17-2021, 08:56 PM
Jeremy2171 Jeremy2171 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by Slamfire View Post
So much denial on this forum! And denial is infinite, and it seems to be intrinsic to the human condition.

Anyway, sure case heads, body splits can and do occur with old ammunition. And the reason is, gunpowder deterioration. That nitrocellulose breaks down into NOX, a spectrum of NO molecules. One of them in nitrogen dioxide (NO2) which is a horrible oxidizer. If you live in Los Angeles, that red haze, particularly noticeable when you fly in, I am certain that is all NO2 that came out of tailpipes. It used to cause all sorts of trouble when it mixes in the atmosphere and comes down as acid rain.




Nitrogen dioxide attacks brass. It is the primary cause of the green corrosion seen inside cases. Might be some other NO molecules causing troubles too, but NO2 is likely the major culprit.



So, a chicken and egg problem. Did the weakening of brass cause the kaboom, or did increasing pressures, due to burn rate instability, cause the case to fail where NO2 weakened it?



There is nothing good about old gunpowder, the stuff will cause your brass to corrode, in bulk it auto ignites, and it has, and it will, blow up your gun.

But, you believe none of this, right?

[img]https://i.imgur.com/JJsh6Tk.jpg[/img]

[img]https://i.imgur.com/aez1i91.jpg[/img]

Or the brass is just brittle from age...like in the 8mm yugo and Turk.
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  #112  
Old 11-18-2021, 04:50 PM
Slamfire Slamfire is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Jeremy2171 View Post
Or the brass is just brittle from age...like in the 8mm yugo and Turk.

Brittle because of age? How does age make brass brittle?


At least for case heads, which are not stressed. You could make a case for necks cracking over time. But case heads?
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  #113  
Old 11-18-2021, 07:26 PM
Jeremy2171 Jeremy2171 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by Slamfire View Post
Brittle because of age? How does age make brass brittle?


At least for case heads, which are not stressed. You could make a case for necks cracking over time. But case heads?
Or bad metallurgy or improperly annealed...

IF it failed due to pressure like you said then the case head and primer would show it...

It doesn't. That flaw in the brass was because the brass was no longer elastic and when the case stretched to fit the chamber the case head doesn't have the ability to stretch so the weak point is right above the case head where the body/head meet and it fails.
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  #114  
Old 12-02-2022, 09:29 AM
ifrarrow ifrarrow is offline
 
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Cabelas sold some Garand ammo back in 2015'ish that was too powerful for garand. Blowing the op rods out of the bolts. Not sure if it was turkish or not. The Greek shoots as good if not better than LC.
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  #115  
Old 12-02-2022, 01:08 PM
mtn71 mtn71 is offline
 
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Jeremy is absolutely correct about the '50s Yugo 8mm ammo. I shot a lot of it way back when. The problem was bad brass, not bad powder.

You'd get little cracks down towards the base. It was disconcerting, and reinforced the idea of safety glasses when shooting, but didn't seem to do any harm to the $50 Turk Mausers we were shooting. I pulled a bunch down and loaded powder and bullets into modern boxer primed brass, and never had an issue.

I'm still shooting Turkish 8mm ammo from the 1930's. When it's clean and corrosion free, it shoots fine. I've also had much newer ammo that went bad, looked like the 30-06 rounds in the previous post. Yeah, when it starts going down that road, it's junk. Salvage the bullets at best.
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  #116  
Old 12-02-2022, 01:47 PM
togor togor is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Slamfire View Post
Brittle because of age? How does age make brass brittle?


At least for case heads, which are not stressed. You could make a case for necks cracking over time. But case heads?
Afraid you are talking to a brick wall on this one sir.
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  #117  
Old 12-02-2022, 06:16 PM
Jeremy2171 Jeremy2171 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by togor View Post
Afraid you are talking to a brick wall on this one sir.
Meaning what exactly?
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  #118  
Old 12-03-2022, 04:27 PM
togor togor is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ifrarrow View Post
Cabelas sold some Garand ammo back in 2015'ish that was too powerful for garand. Blowing the op rods out of the bolts. Not sure if it was turkish or not. The Greek shoots as good if not better than LC.
Some of the Austrian got a bad rep. Might even be some on GB up right now. If it's what I think it is....ouch....for someone.
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